[Franz©]

I only use PVC underground, and I refuse to touch plastic boxes since they came out in 1963. I also refuse to pull lines with plastic elbows or 45s. Watched enough pulls burn through the side of them things.
Rigid belongs where rigid belongs and I can bend and thread to 5" with the Enerpac.
Romex is good for temporary work. It don't belong in office or commercial buildings.

I never argue with people who work for less, they know their value, and for 30 years all my Proposals have gone out watermarked and ©. I got tired of writing specks for people to use to run through a Xerox machine and use as their RFQ to bid a job. You want that service, you are going to pay mne for it, and I won't bid your job because my gut says you won't pay. Use my specs for an RFQ, you ain't going to be happy when you get my bill, and my Lawyer will be happy to collect.

I had all the sorryazz so called contractors I needed long ago when a so called electrical contractor underbid me and then had the guts to call and ask if he could borrow pulling equipment to do the job. Nope, but I can tell you who rents it, and when I get off this call I'll call the rental house to tell them you deserve premium pricing.

I generally give out 3 business cards at a time, one to rip up and throw at me, one to throw in the trash bucket, and one to hide in your desk till you got no choice but calling me.

[tweake]

So i may need to step down to about a 180amp machine... Unimig make this..
https://www.ewelders.com.au/unimig-vipe ... r-package/

To Quote them:
Ever wanted wanted to be able to plug a semi-industrial Powered MIG welder straight into a standard 10amp power point? Here's your answer.

The UniMig Viper MIG 180 is the most powerful MIG welder in Australia legally fitted with a 10amp plug. The Viper MIG has added MMA (Arc) function, uses Jasic's renowned inverter technology and is extremely competitively priced making it ideal for the serious DIY usr or tradesman.

i call BS on that.
theres no way a 180 amp machine, 7.5kva, with a 0.67 power factor ! is ever going to run off a 10 amp supply.
maybe the 150 amp version might and thats probably Chineseism amps to.

[tweake]

Buy the 250 and make an adapter cord.

Why is it you inverted people are so confused? You use amps & volts like civilized people, but you can't understand inches. You used to be able to understand inches. The damn limeys invented inches.
Use proper measurments.

Do you realize that damn metric crud forces decent people to grab rulers to understand what you're talking about?

sure use an adapter. no warranty, no insurance, probably melted plugs/sockets, assuming you can stop the breaker from tripping.
just throw a match on your house and walk away.

we do use inches, its still in common use, but most of us have moved on the better things.
but most people here don't translate fractions of an inch.

[tweake]

Our code books include specific instructions as to how to terminate wire. It's rare to find a connection properly made. I say the hook bent in the wire to wrap around a screw should be J shaped.

ours do not wrap around a screw. they are always sods of things and do not work well with multi strand cables.
great if you use crimps. i only see that on low voltage gear (12v etc).
we used hole with a screw through the side.
hopefully i can hot link this pic.


poke the wire in and crank on the screw. for skinny wires you fold it over give a bit more meat for the screw to bite into.
it also makes daisy chaining easy.
one problem i'm told that does arise is connections coming loose over time. not sure of thats just a heat thing or metal thing.

Is it actually the tip of the screw that contacts the wire? I'm not impressed

no. the whole 'hole' is brass. so the screw shoves the wire sideways into the brass as well as bites into the cable itself.
so you get a good contact aera as well. keep in mind that tip of the screw is also really big. you can put two cables in easily, by mem can fit three, not sure on more. (its not my aera of expertise).

[tweake]

A wall box serves one purpose; it contains a fire. For many years I resisted, and still used metal boxes. They stand a good chance of containing a fire. Then, I realized that my competitors were undercutting my price by using plastic boxes, twist wire nuts, and lots of #14 wire. I figured out I wasn't making anything safer when I was losing jobs to corner cutting electricians. I have surrendered, I use some plastic boxes, yes I'm ashamed. I use some twist wire nuts, yes I'm ashamed. I haven't surrendered ALL ethics, I won't use back wired devices. Yes, I use a ton of plastic conduit. Fires don't start mid span. Fires start at connections.

Willie

plastic boxes are normal here. however there is fire standards on certain buildings. so still see metal but more often theres other anti fire measures. no idea what currently used now, but many decades ok i ran into this stuff they put in the back of the box, that under heat will expand pushing the wall plate out and sealing the wall.

[Franz©]

Buy the 250 and make an adapter cord.

Why is it you inverted people are so confused? You use amps & volts like civilized people, but you can't understand inches. You used to be able to understand inches. The damn limeys invented inches.
Use proper measurments.

Do you realize that damn metric crud forces decent people to grab rulers to understand what you're talking about?

sure use an adapter. no warranty, no insurance, probably melted plugs/sockets, assuming you can stop the breaker from tripping.
just throw a match on your house and walk away.

we do use inches, its still in common use, but most of us have moved on the better things.
but most people here don't translate fractions of an inch.

Breathe in and out slowly Tweak, you're steamin like you got a government inspector livin in your attic 24/7 logging the number of farts per Fosters.

First, I'll tell you Metric is an evil conspiricy by the SnapOn Tool company,(favored by lesbians the world round) to sell a whole bunch of tools that weren't needed by mechanics. It was worse than Wentworth when that crap got going. I had a pickup in 78 that had both inches and metric, just to make me buy metrics. If you've any doubt just ponder that the metric sockets are 1/4, 3/8 and 1/2 INCH drive. Pure evil.

Now, take another deep breath, and fart to clear your head.
assuming you can stop the breaker from tripping. Right there lies the whole safety factor in the system of using an adaptor. You get to run the welder at the low end of its power delivery ability all the way up to where it pops the breaker.
Since the breaker pops at 10 amps, the breaker prevents the receptical, the adaptor and the building wiring from overheating.
So you see you got all worked up over a nonproblem.
If and when you need maximum welder output, move the machine and the job to a location where you have an appropriate receptical and weld away.

Far as throwing matches on the house, I didn't know you could still have matches since the Government took all your guns.
Relax and pour a Fosters down your neck and dream of being that Dundee fellow with the big knife and welding up a barbie to throw yer shrimp on.

Next week we can discuss the stupidity of pumping sewerage into Sidney Bay via a tunnel from the dryest island on Earth, and how Sidney could easily copy the Disney system of lily ponds to reclainm and reuse the water since the climates are very similar.

Enjoy your Fosters now.

[tweake]

Buy the 250 and make an adapter cord.

Why is it you inverted people are so confused? You use amps & volts like civilized people, but you can't understand inches. You used to be able to understand inches. The damn limeys invented inches.
Use proper measurments.

Do you realize that damn metric crud forces decent people to grab rulers to understand what you're talking about?

sure use an adapter. no warranty, no insurance, probably melted plugs/sockets, assuming you can stop the breaker from tripping.
just throw a match on your house and walk away.

we do use inches, its still in common use, but most of us have moved on the better things.
but most people here don't translate fractions of an inch.

Breathe in and out slowly Tweak, you're steamin like you got a government inspector livin in your attic 24/7 logging the number of farts per Fosters.

First, I'll tell you Metric is an evil conspiricy by the SnapOn Tool company,(favored by lesbians the world round) to sell a whole bunch of tools that weren't needed by mechanics. It was worse than Wentworth when that crap got going. I had a pickup in 78 that had both inches and metric, just to make me buy metrics. If you've any doubt just ponder that the metric sockets are 1/4, 3/8 and 1/2 INCH drive. Pure evil.

Now, take another deep breath, and fart to clear your head.
assuming you can stop the breaker from tripping. Right there lies the whole safety factor in the system of using an adaptor. You get to run the welder at the low end of its power delivery ability all the way up to where it pops the breaker.
Since the breaker pops at 10 amps, the breaker prevents the receptical, the adaptor and the building wiring from overheating.
So you see you got all worked up over a nonproblem.
If and when you need maximum welder output, move the machine and the job to a location where you have an appropriate receptical and weld away.

Far as throwing matches on the house, I didn't know you could still have matches since the Government took all your guns.
Relax and pour a Fosters down your neck and dream of being that Dundee fellow with the big knife and welding up a barbie to throw yer shrimp on.

Next week we can discuss the stupidity of pumping sewerage into Sidney Bay via a tunnel from the dryest island on Earth, and how Sidney could easily copy the Disney system of lily ponds to reclainm and reuse the water since the climates are very similar.

Enjoy your Fosters now.

fosters.......ewwwww.

trouble is 10 amp sockets typically have 16 to 20 amp breakers on the circuit. breakers are to protect the wiring not the sockets. sockets can go up in flames but not the cable. not sure who devised that gem, they must have drunk fosters.

[Bill Beauregard]

Let me give an extreme example, manufactured housing. Late last century mobile homes were mass produced. One factory I know of did four homes a day.

A circuit runs from the breaker panel, the cheapest panel on the market. In some units it might run to the opposite corner of the module to a junction. From there it branches to two rows of daisy chained outlets. Each outlet is backwired.

The junction box is located in a place likely to be damp. Wire nuts are the cheapest available. They are installed by piecework employees with little training. Inside, the boxes are small, and wall sheathing is pre covered with mylar wallpaper. Winter heated air passes through these outlets and cools. As it does, relative humidity rises. All winter these receptacles on outside walls are wet. Typically, these things go quite a while, then bad connections develop. Under only lighting loads, a problem might present as a funny smell, a bit of noise, an electrician is called, it is fixed.
When a new floor is installed, tools are plugged in. OR mrs Smith is cold, she plugs in a space heater. OR an air conditioner is plugged in. One of those damp connections resisting the flow of electrons gets hot. Results range from a non functional circuit, to a fire.

These circuit breakers work on amperage. No excess amperage has occurred. The circuit has not short circuited, nor exceeded the load.

In 1997 VT adopted code requiring ARC FAULT CIRCUIT INTERRUPTING BREAKERS for many circuits. These breakers recognise irregularities in the sine wave of alternating current, and trip. Trouble is, few complied with this law.

I have no idea how many fires have happened when general use circuits are used for heavy loads such as welders, heaters, tools, compressors, air conditioners, and even vacuum cleaners.

Willie

[A36]

I cannot offer any advice regarding the 2 machines you are interested in but as far as the electrical aspect, in the US we have an organization called NEMA (National electrical manufactures association) that sets standards for receptacles /plugs. I'm sure Australia has a similar organization. Ideally you want to have a dedicated circuit (wire, plugs, receptacles and breaker) sized accordingly to the amperage draw of your equipment. If you're going to run your equipment at a lower wattage setting, you can size your circuit accordingly but will have a limit where you will start to trip breakers and will not be able to use the machine to it's full potential. Australia and many other countries have the advantage of a 230V system allowing the same appliance to draw 1/2 the amperage it would on a 120V system. Again, a circuit is sized by amperage. My 50 amp circuit Lincoln welder would only need a 25 amp circuit in Australia.
The key is to size materials properly and keep connections tight as a loose connection will arc and create very high temperatures (arc welding) melting everything around it. If you're lucky, an open circuit will develop and the current will cease, if you're unlucky it will keep arcing and cause a fire.

[Franz©]

Bill, you neglect to factor in that manufactured housing is pretty much exempt from the National Electric Code because the whole damn trailer plugs into an outlet. The absolute crap that is called a wiring system in a trailer is an ignition source. Though it seemed impossible trailer manufacturers managed to find inferior wire & devices for the mass buildout for FEMA.

As to the NEC adopted by Vermont, how many years old was the Code Vermont adopted?

Codes have become interesting collections of SUGGESTIONS in the US, open to interpitation by Inspectors who often are also contractors, and become sub-contractors to the Electrical Contractor for each Inspection. Around here, since the collapse of NY Board of Fire Underwriters, we are blessed by a collection of Romex Ropers inspecting commercial and industrial work and offering their "expert opinion" on bonding of service entrance equipment.

We're still allowed to go far above wire ampacity on motor circuits to accomodate start current, so low bidders can install crap equipment in plastic breaker boxes where the breakers arc the bus to hell and back.

AFCI breakers are another trip to hell. GFIs, I installed one of the first P&S units in 69 on a pool to meet Code. The Inspector came on the job looked and said "the electrician is really sticking it to the customer, we don't enforce this section of the Code" right in front of the pool owner.
Code enforcment was a sham then and it hasn't gotten one bit better since.

[Bill Beauregard]

My post was long as it is. No, mobile homes are not held to NEC compliance. The excuse I get is mobile homes are low income housing, HUD takes the greater power as the residents are low income.
Still, I haven't mentioned any NEC code this practice violates except that ALL wiring devices must be "listed" Commonly this means UL. Backwired devices are not listed for #12 wire. In a few cases they are used with #12. Typically this is limited to laundry, bath, and kitchen. A low bid electrician can use the same techniques in built in place homes.

Vermont amends NEC before adopting. In terms of law, we are a liberal state. Lawmakers believe EVERY problem needs a new law. Crime rates are very low in VT because criminals are seldom charged, and almost never convicted.

We have plenty of code, but limited, then spotty enforcement. Only through lawsuits are rules ever enforced. I want to hold my head high with honor, I don't want to be sued. I do the best I can, I don't want to cause loss, injury, or death.

Willie

[Franz©]

Look in your code book Bill.
There is a section on emergency standby gensets.
Major requirement is that the genset cannot be fueled by a source like utility NG that relies on electric grid power to pump the gas.

Look around municipal buildings and see how many gensets meet Code.

[Coldman]

Ozzy History Lesson.
In the good old days, houses were wired with ceramic fuse holders with 10amp fuse wire inserted. These domestic power circuits were called 10amp circuits. Any number of power points could be fitted. If you instantaneously switched on a 10amp load, the fuse wire would blow. If you incrementally switched on small loads, the fuse wire would hold 15amps before it blew. Therefore fixed wiring had to be minimum 1.5mm2 to be able to carry 15amps safely. These days we have circuit breakers and they are rated at normally 16amps for domestic power circuits. These circuit breakers will trip at 16amps where incremental or instantaneous. Still any amount of power points are allowed to be fitted and any number of motors up to 1.75HP (1.3kW) can be plugged in. If too much is actually turned on the breaker will trip at 16amps anyway, all good no fires just a lesson to switch stuff off you don't need running.
If you get a big welder power source, cut the big plug off and put a 10 amp plug on it, you are not breaking any law. Plug it in, switch it on and wind up the dial all that will happen is the circuit breaker will trip, no fires just you're not getting any welding done soon. The biggest risk here is that inverter type power sources can get damaged if high inrush current is not supplied when called for.
Bigger power sources need bigger circuits. If you're not prepared to wire in a bigger circuit to suit a bigger machine, you should stay with little tacker welders that won't trip your domestic power breaker. It's a no brainer.

@Bill
Understand what you say but you're talking about a circuits/wiring in fault due to bad workmanship. If the circuit was not faulty it would be ok.

@Franz
Very hard to find Fosters over here, nobody will drink it. They ship it all off to USA so the Americans think they are finally drinking a decent beer. (haha the joke's on you buddy)
When I was in college a long time ago, we were told all engineering systems of measurement and quantities worked and are valid and we should know them all and be prepared to use them. We were then drilled in Imperial, metric, SI, and yankee systems. We have parts and machinery coming in from all over. Threads can be Whitworth, UNC, Metric, BSP, NPT, JIC, Kabota, and many more for example. So we got the good training after all and can handle it. Why can't you handle it? been drinking too much Fosters?
We all like a joke and we can sure take it. You know if you want to take the piss out of us successfully, you really should be getting your facts and spelling at least close to right cause all you're doing is giving yourself an uppercut in public right now. Go for a walk over the Golden Door Bridge and cool off.

[tweake]

My post was long as it is. No, mobile homes are not held to NEC compliance. ..........

We have plenty of code, but limited, then spotty enforcement. Only through lawsuits are rules ever enforced. I want to hold my head high with honor, I don't want to be sued. I do the best I can, I don't want to cause loss, injury, or death.

Willie

over here all mobile homes/campers etc have to pass an electrical inspection. not sure it might be yearly or 3 yearly.
we get imported caravans coming in and often they need to be completely rewired.

codes/laws are only as good as the stick behind it.
sounds like the industry is getting rotten.
my fav saying, "they are so bad they think they are good."

[tweake]

Hi,
So i had to move house and i used to do some welding there using a BOC 250r (had the 15amp plug)

getting back on topic a bit.
i notice that welder now comes with a 32amp plug on it.

[Franz©]

Joke's on you Coldman. I don't bother with people who use little crayon drawings. I also don't drink beer since I worked a beer foundry job back in the 60s.
Bigger joke is you went to engineering school and are probably still paying for it.

I turned spell check off so Aussies like you could read it. Now run along and eat your Vegimite.
When you're grown enough to wear long pants get back to me.

[Coldman]

Don’t know what a crayon drawing is, maybe you can share your knowledge some more.

School was a long time ago, paid cash up front for it like everything else. Worked hard, did a great job and got paid well. Don’t owe a brass razoo to anyone.

You need spell checker? Maybe you should go back to school. Need a loan?

I commend you for not drinking beer, you’re a wiser man than me.

I don’t eat axle grease (vegimite). Actually made by an American company for decades so you probably put in your possum stew and cornpone which is why you’re such a grumpy old codger.

Been wearing long pants a very long time, but not as long as you. I still have all my teeth, hair and masculine prowess. Not frustrated at all

By the way I really appreciate your posts, you obviously have a lot a knowledge and experience. Keep it coming!



Sent using Tapatalk

[ljdm1956]

post deleted

[Downwindtracker2]

Maybe wiser, but not as much fun.

[Bill Beauregard]

I must have missed something. What happened?

Willie

[ljdm1956]

walter.jpg (6.12 KiB) Viewed 1471 times

I must have missed something. What happened?

Willie

Oh what the heck, might as well repost, by reading this thread, it seems like one of the posters might look like this: LOL

[Franz©]

walter.jpg

I must have missed something. What happened?

Willie

Oh what the heck, might as well repost, by reading this thread, it seems like one of the posters might look like this: LOL

First you post a selfie, then you take it down, then you post it again. You seem to have issues.

[ljdm1956]

walter.jpg

I must have missed something. What happened?

Willie

Oh what the heck, might as well repost, by reading this thread, it seems like one of the posters might look like this: LOL

First you post a selfie, then you take it down, then you post it again. You seem to have issues.

Hell, never denied I had issues! I post here, evidence enough. More important, did I come close with the pic? All in good fun.

[ljdm1956]

walter.jpg

I must have missed something. What happened?

Willie

Oh what the heck, might as well repost, by reading this thread, it seems like one of the posters might look like this: LOL

First you post a selfie, then you take it down, then you post it again. You seem to have issues.

Nah, I'm highly allergic to sweater vests.