Very true. Zinc aka galvanized will get you metal fume fever. Cadmium plating will really mess you up. Make sure to remove all coatings AND water a respirator!
I didn't ask, but are the washers 1/8" thick?
silentneko
- silentneko
-
Workhorse
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:01 pm
That's a pretty good idea. If I cut the spacers out of 16ga sheet steel then I at least won't have to deal with the tight radius. The washers are all zinc coated so by the time I grind it off it might be to thin. The washers are about 16ga. Is there a big difference between zinc coated and galvanized when it comes to off gassing?
For some reason I had thought they were 1/8" thick washers. 1/16" is even tougher! Galvanized means it has a zinc plating, so it's basically the same thing. You don't wanna breath that stuff in.silentneko wrote:That's a pretty good idea. If I cut the spacers out of 16ga sheet steel then I at least won't have to deal with the tight radius. The washers are all zinc coated so by the time I grind it off it might be to thin. The washers are about 16ga. Is there a big difference between zinc coated and galvanized when it comes to off gassing?
silentneko
- silentneko
-
Workhorse
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:01 pm
I think I'd be ok if they were 1/8" washers using the 3/32" 6013 rods without burning them to much, but at 1/16" it's kickin my butt, lol.
I'm going to try straight runs with the 16ga steel on the 1/8" next week. Maybe by taking out the variable of the radius I can find some success.
I'm going to try straight runs with the 16ga steel on the 1/8" next week. Maybe by taking out the variable of the radius I can find some success.
So what amperage did you end up running on the 1/16" E6013 rods? Saying "35 to 60 amps" doesn't actually say much.silentneko wrote:I think I'd be ok if they were 1/8" washers using the 3/32" 6013 rods without burning them to much, but at 1/16" it's kickin my butt, lol.
I'm going to try straight runs with the 16ga steel on the 1/8" next week. Maybe by taking out the variable of the radius I can find some success.
If your just looking to add shims to take up slack, as mentioned, use a piece of 1/8” materiel and drill holes in it for slot welds.
Another option is using strips of 1/8” thick flat bar and stitch weld those.
You have much grinding to do with a flapper disc to get those poorly welded washers down to 1/8” thickness.
Because of all the gaps, you can expect water to get in there and that will lead to rusting.
I stick weld a lot of 1/8” sheet metal and usually use 1/8 6010 electrodes for that.
Another option is using strips of 1/8” thick flat bar and stitch weld those.
You have much grinding to do with a flapper disc to get those poorly welded washers down to 1/8” thickness.
Because of all the gaps, you can expect water to get in there and that will lead to rusting.
I stick weld a lot of 1/8” sheet metal and usually use 1/8 6010 electrodes for that.
Last edited by snoeproe on Sun Feb 09, 2020 12:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
silentneko
- silentneko
-
Workhorse
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:01 pm
The 1/16" 6013 ran best at 55amps if memory serves.
I need to add 1/16" to each side of the tongue so it is centered in the sleeve without much movement. At the time the washers seemed like the easiest solution, but I was wrong. The gaps are why I wanted to do a full weld, but also since it will be inside the sleeve when used, and in a garage when not, I think I can manage the rust. A dose of cold galvanizing compound and corrosionX has worked well on my other parts over the years.
I need to add 1/16" to each side of the tongue so it is centered in the sleeve without much movement. At the time the washers seemed like the easiest solution, but I was wrong. The gaps are why I wanted to do a full weld, but also since it will be inside the sleeve when used, and in a garage when not, I think I can manage the rust. A dose of cold galvanizing compound and corrosionX has worked well on my other parts over the years.
I had initially recommended 55A because I thought they were 1/8" washers. Now nowing they are closer to 1/16", I would have probably recommended lesser amperage. I'm about to head to home depot to pick up some muriatic acid and Naval Jelly rust remover, perhaps I will pick up some of these washers to try it out myself.silentneko wrote:The 1/16" 6013 ran best at 55amps if memory serves.
I need to add 1/16" to each side of the tongue so it is centered in the sleeve without much movement. At the time the washers seemed like the easiest solution, but I was wrong. The gaps are why I wanted to do a full weld, but also since it will be inside the sleeve when used, and in a garage when not, I think I can manage the rust. A dose of cold galvanizing compound and corrosionX has worked well on my other parts over the years.
silentneko
- silentneko
-
Workhorse
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:01 pm
I see you like a challenge, lol. I ended up trying everything from 20 to 60amps with them. I think 50-55 amps worked the best. Below 35 amps striking the arc was a challenge and they stuck a lot.
So I saw washers, but you'll have to guide me as to which ones exactly you are using. I found three thicknesses in a similar size (diameter) to what you were using (I think): ≈0.040", ≈0.083", ≈0.120".silentneko wrote:I see you like a challenge, lol. I ended up trying everything from 20 to 60amps with them. I think 50-55 amps worked the best. Below 35 amps striking the arc was a challenge and they stuck a lot.
So which one are you using?
Hell yea, I love a challenge. Not only do I like challenges, I will use my seldom-used 50ft water-cooled stick electrode stinger, together with my 400A AC/DC TIG welder, to weld washers to scrap 1/8" flatbar with E6013's. Ah, life is peachy.
Last edited by Oscar on Sun Feb 09, 2020 7:17 pm, edited 3 times in total.
silentneko
- silentneko
-
Workhorse
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:01 pm
They are 1.5 diameter fender washers for 1/2" bolts. I can't see your picks, but they are a hair under 16ga, so I'm guessing the 0.040". I bought them from Lowe's, but they don't have the listed thickness on the pack. You got a good supply of toys, enjoy them!
Actually had to edit video, crap takes forever!
silentneko
- silentneko
-
Workhorse
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:01 pm
I had a little success too. I cut some squares and got some advise from a coworker on how he does it. So basically I used the 3/32" 6013 and made small circles. I focused about 75% on the 1/8" and 25% on the 16ga.
I know it's not perfect, but the sides were my last 2 welds and I feel they can be good enough with a little more practice.
I know it's not perfect, but the sides were my last 2 welds and I feel they can be good enough with a little more practice.
- 20200209_195630.jpg (48.09 KiB) Viewed 3798 times
I might give it a try myself. Looks interesting lol.
I think you're on the right track with square sheet metal instead of washer. Galvy can be a PITA.
For a weld that small I wouldn't bother with the small circles technique. Try a simple step technique. Light up, pause for 1 or 2 seconds, scootch forward a 1/16 or 1/8, pause and repeat.
Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk
I think you're on the right track with square sheet metal instead of washer. Galvy can be a PITA.
For a weld that small I wouldn't bother with the small circles technique. Try a simple step technique. Light up, pause for 1 or 2 seconds, scootch forward a 1/16 or 1/8, pause and repeat.
Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk
Not perfect, but it came out ok for 1st try.
Oh, forgot to lower the volume on the video. Lower the volume on your computer since the 2300 CFM ventilator fan is full blast.
rVYoNjhb7I0
Oh, forgot to lower the volume on the video. Lower the volume on your computer since the 2300 CFM ventilator fan is full blast.
rVYoNjhb7I0
That looks much better. The "small circles" is basically a technique that we were mentioning as a form of heat control where the majority of the heat (and thus time) is spent on the thicker part, and then the puddle is washed over a little onto the thinner part. As long as the movements are kept within reason and don't deviate more than a mm or two (basically half the thickness of the rod, roughly), you shouldn't encounter too much slag entrapmennt. As you keep practicing, you will get the hang of it.silentneko wrote:I had a little success too. I cut some squares and got some advise from a coworker on how he does it. So basically I used the 3/32" 6013 and made small circles. I focused about 75% on the 1/8" and 25% on the 16ga.
I know it's not perfect, but the sides were my last 2 welds and I feel they can be good enough with a little more practice.
JayWal wrote:
For a weld that small I wouldn't bother with the small circles technique.
Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk
I was going to say the same. I would do a straight drag or a slight weave. A step and pause would be ok but I would not wash back into the weld with any of the techniques. I could be wrong but I think you will create slag inclusions. In the end this project is not critical so no big deal.
This link does not give you specific details for your project but I found it to be very helpful for getting me in the ballpark, along with the actual rod specification sheets.
https://www.lincolnelectric.com/assets/ ... /c2410.pdf
cheers.
[quote/="JayWal"]
For a weld that small I wouldn't bother with the small circles technique.
Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk[/quote]
I was going to say the same. I would do a straight drag or a slight weave. A step and pause would be ok but I would not wash back into the weld too much with any of the techniques. I could be wrong but I think you will create slag inclusions and you will be depositing more metal which is not your goal. In the end this project is not critical so no big deal.
This link does not give you specific details for your project but I found it to be very helpful for getting me in the ballpark, along with the actual rod specification sheets.
https://www.lincolnelectric.com/assets/ ... /c2410.pdf
cheers.
take my stick welding advice with caution, I am an electrician and try not to arc weld too much...lol
For a weld that small I wouldn't bother with the small circles technique.
Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk[/quote]
I was going to say the same. I would do a straight drag or a slight weave. A step and pause would be ok but I would not wash back into the weld too much with any of the techniques. I could be wrong but I think you will create slag inclusions and you will be depositing more metal which is not your goal. In the end this project is not critical so no big deal.
This link does not give you specific details for your project but I found it to be very helpful for getting me in the ballpark, along with the actual rod specification sheets.
https://www.lincolnelectric.com/assets/ ... /c2410.pdf
cheers.
take my stick welding advice with caution, I am an electrician and try not to arc weld too much...lol
I would do this with 1/8" or 3/32" diameter rod. I've done similar stuff before.
The trick is to run the weld outside the washer and whip it into the washer as you go, the washer metal will peel back if you burn right on it, so you just whip the puddle into it as you go, kind of like an awkward weave and then it should do it.
Strike outside the washer and move it in over it and back out, just keep going like that, oughta work.
If I was doing this, seriously, I would TIG it but I also prefer TIG. BUT for the sake of the argument, the above is how I would do this.
The trick is to run the weld outside the washer and whip it into the washer as you go, the washer metal will peel back if you burn right on it, so you just whip the puddle into it as you go, kind of like an awkward weave and then it should do it.
Strike outside the washer and move it in over it and back out, just keep going like that, oughta work.
If I was doing this, seriously, I would TIG it but I also prefer TIG. BUT for the sake of the argument, the above is how I would do this.
if there's a welder, there's a way
silentneko
- silentneko
-
Workhorse
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:01 pm
Well you did better then me Oscar, lol.
Sim thanks for that link. I'll look through it later on.
Oliveros, I am set up for TIG, but haven't really started learning the process yet.
As far as the little circles, I mean real tight, almost a weaving pattern. My friend at work used it on a test run, and nailed a perfect weld the first shot. He used to do it for a living.
So let me make you guys laugh. I did not know you could touch the electrode. I thought if you touched anything but the stinger you might get zapped. Most of the videos appear this way. Well now that I know better it's way easier to guide a rod.
Sim thanks for that link. I'll look through it later on.
Oliveros, I am set up for TIG, but haven't really started learning the process yet.
As far as the little circles, I mean real tight, almost a weaving pattern. My friend at work used it on a test run, and nailed a perfect weld the first shot. He used to do it for a living.
So let me make you guys laugh. I did not know you could touch the electrode. I thought if you touched anything but the stinger you might get zapped. Most of the videos appear this way. Well now that I know better it's way easier to guide a rod.
Yeah a 1/16 rod will whip a lot if you only hold the stinger. But yeah you can definetly grab the rod. Great trick for tacking stuff is hold the rod like a pencil, 2 inches or so from the end. Gets you a lot more accurate tacks and less stuck electrodes. But be careful if you do stick it, the rod can get real hot real fast.
Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk
Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk
Lol. It's one of those things that is bound to happen, and your bound to learn real quick! Lol. At 55amps should not be too badJayWal wrote:Yeah a 1/16 rod will whip a lot if you only hold the stinger. But yeah you can definetly grab the rod. Great trick for tacking stuff is hold the rod like a pencil, 2 inches or so from the end. Gets you a lot more accurate tacks and less stuck electrodes. But be careful if you do stick it, the rod can get real hot real fast.
Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk
Cheers
Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
Lol. It's one of those things that is bound to happen, and your bound to learn real quick! Lol. At 55amps should not be too badJayWal wrote:Yeah a 1/16 rod will whip a lot if you only hold the stinger. But yeah you can definetly grab the rod. Great trick for tacking stuff is hold the rod like a pencil, 2 inches or so from the end. Gets you a lot more accurate tacks and less stuck electrodes. But be careful if you do stick it, the rod can get real hot real fast.
Sent from my SM-G970W using Tapatalk
Cheers
Ps. Just remember the welder can electrocute. On average 4 out of 1000 will die in the usa using welding, plasma equipment etc.
No need to be paranoid but take a minute to understand the basic nature of electricity.
Here is a short article on the subject.
Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
TIG is not hard to learn, with the amount of time you put in so far, you probably could've figured it out with TIG, but it does present its own set of challenges in this case as well.
Hope it works out for you either way.
Hope it works out for you either way.
if there's a welder, there's a way
silentneko
- silentneko
-
Workhorse
-
Posts:
-
Joined:Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:01 pm
I got half of it done last night. The first 8 plates are welded on. After a lot of playing around I went with 5/32" 6013 at 65 amps.
Here are a few shots. I know they aren't super pretty, but they will work.
Here are a few shots. I know they aren't super pretty, but they will work.
- 20200212_185743.jpg (39.22 KiB) Viewed 3640 times
- 20200212_193213.jpg (43.08 KiB) Viewed 3640 times