[av8r]

I am learning to weld on a Lincoln-Electric Invertec 350P but I am also practicing on an AC machine. Arc starting on the Invertec machine appears to be much easier than with an AC only machine. On the Invertec I can quickly scratch or "pogo-stick" off the surface to a distance of around 1/16" to 1/8" and the arc quickly stabilizes. The rod almost never sticks. With the AC machine after touching the stick to the surface the stick needs to be held almost touching the surface for a brief period of time while the arc gets established. I assume that the flux vaporization is part of the process of stabilizing the arc. I was wondering if there are some tips out there to deal with starting arcs on AC only machines. Some ideas that I have is to assure that the flux extends all the way to the stick tip so it is heated as soon as possible. Thanks.

[kermdawg]

All the basic tips for getting a good arc apply, they are just much more important with an AC machine, cause you dont have any hot start, dig or anything like that.

Most important tip I can give you is your work clamp. Make sure its good and tight, and make sure its grounded to clean, shiny metal as close as reasonably possible to the piece your welding too. After I did this, it was much easier to get an arc goin. Also, make sure your metal your welding is as clean as possible.

You really have to be light with your rod when your striking the arc. Feather touch. I havent been able to get the "tapping" method to work on AC at all, so I just gently brush or tickle the metal as lightly as possible, and try not to pull away too much.

Personally, I changed out the stinger on my ac buzzbox too to a tweeco one, and I thought that helped a good deal, though it may just be me. That stock one with the plastic handle just made me laugh lol.

having a rod oven would help too, cause when the rods warmer its a hell of alot easier to start.

[Otto Nobedder]

Ever shoot pool?

(Assuming you're right handed; invert if you're a southpaw), place your left hand beside where you intend to start, with the rod in the "crutch" of your left thumb and forefinger, and aim like shooting pool. As you contact the metal, raise the "bridge" of your left hand slightly. If you have everything at the right angle, the slight movement of your left hand will lift the end of the rod just enough to start your arc. Once the arc is established, you'll want to get your left hand out of there before the rod gets hot.

Many people consider "cue-sticking" to be an amateur tactic, but I disagree. If you are pipe-welding on a job, the inspector does not want to see arc strikes outside the weld zone. This allows you to start exactly where you want to, even with a flip-down hood (which is what I prefer).

Steve

[DanW]

something I do when i'm having trouble starting an arc is get a piece of scrap and run the rod really quickly and really lightly over the surface, too fast to start a stable arc but basically sparks a bit and leaves a big black arc strike on the scrap

after doing that it's much easier to strike on the work piece. this is welding stainless with 316L rods, they seem to stick a little when using a fresh rod until i do this. half used rods seem to fire up easier

hope that helps
Dan

[jpence38]

It also helps to use rod that is made for AC

[1080TWIST]

also if your first strike doesnt go very well and leaves the flux on the end of the rod a little irregular gently break the flux away with your other gloved hand being carefull to just expose the very tip. this should help with your next attempt, good news if you can strike standard 7018 with a regular old AC machine it will all seem like cake from there on

[av8r]

Thanks everyone. I did a little home project building a lumber rack out of old bed frames using my Lincoln AC180. Most of the welds were 1 to 2 inches in length. I used the recommendation to cut the electrodes in half to make them easier to control. This helped out quite a bit. I also used the 'pool cue' technique. I was originally tentative about resting my gloved hand on the work piece and also holding the hot electrode. It worked great. I now use this for 12" rod. For my project, I used 3/32" 6013 and 7018 mostly because that is what I had been given along with the machine. The rod was probably 15 to 20 years old. After completing this project I felt a bit more confident using this machine. If I had new rod and 7018AC it would probably work a little better. When I went to welding class I spent four hours practicing with 6010 using the Lincoln Invertec 350P. I'm still working on controlling the puddle. What a difference with the 350P. My instructor always laughs at me about my project to learn SMAW with an old boat anchor from the 60's.

[Ultralow787]

I just read a magazine article that explains the difference between 6010 and 6011 really well. The difference in the cellulose fluxes are that the 6010 cellulose is Sodium based and the 6011 cellulose is Potassium based. The 6011 flux helps to keep the arc "lit" while the AC current crosses to 0 volts. With DC+ and 6010, it is not a factor because the output stays at the high positive DC voltage continuously. AC alternates between + and - 60 times per second.

I'm thinking that the 7018AC rods are made using a flux that does this as well.

I too, have the Lincoln Invertec 350P at work, but only an old AC Buzzbox at home.