Welding Tips and Tricks

Hi all,

I've just started to weld. I only envisage smallish DIY projects such as stands, shelving brackets, etc., and I'm on a budget, so I decided to go with SMAW/MMA. I have an IGBT-type DC inverter (10-140A) and I'm using 6013 electrodes (2.5 mm) on DCEP. The 6013s were recommended to me in the shop where I bought the machine. According to the sales rep, they are the most generally used DIY electrode here in South Africa. According to my reading, the same is true for the UK, but not for the US.

OK, so I've tried to run a few beads on a flat plate and angle iron scraps, using various electrode angles, currents and arc lengths. I've run into several challenges and I'd appreciate any advice from you.
1) Striking the arc is easy at 100A, but by the look of the bead (flat with spatter), that's too much current. 85-90A gives a nicer bead (still inconsistent, but not as bad), but starting is more difficult. Where should I trade off? I do file the electrode before each start. Things are even worse if I don't.
2) I can't seem to see the arc, the puddle (weld pool) and the slag as three distinct items. Discerning the puddle from the slag is especially difficult. I seem to see only a large slag cap right next to the electrode, that cools down as I move along. And once I chip off the slag, the bead is much thinner than expected. Am I going too fast? The slag is difficult to remove, by the way.
3) But if I try to go slower and/or try to keep a tighter arc, I often have the slag bunching up against the electrode, sometimes putting the arc out.
4) My plate is only about 2 mm (3/32") thick. It tends to heat up quite fast. Is this part of my problem - should I be using thicker plates? Or thinner electrodes?
5) Depending on availability, I'll try to get some other electrode sizes and types, e.g. 6010. Your take on this?

I've had a look at Jody's videos, as well as that from the Welding Institute. They certainly make it look easier than it is... Any help appreciated!

Cheers,
Mark

Not the best form to reply to myself, I suppose, but I just wanted to say that I've also found a (copy of a) very instructive video by Steve Bleile.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrFxti6o ... re=related
This has given me many pointers on my questions.

6013 is a very common rod for hobby/light farm and home use in the U.S., and it will run on DCEP (heck, it'll run DCEN), but it's primary purpose is as an AC rod, for basic sine-wave "crackerbox" welders, and you won't get great results in DC mode.

6010 is a DCEP rod (6011 is it's AC equivalent), with DEEP penetration, and very little slag buildup. It has lower current requirements for the same size rod. It will give you fits trying to learn it on thin material.

I would explore 7014 and 7018 rods. 7018 is frustrating to learn, but is, in my opinion, the most useful DC rod for carbon steel. 7014 is reputed to be much easier to handle, though in 30 years I've never used it. Others here have, and can advise.

Steve

Thanks, Otto.

From what I've read, if I go with 7018, I'll have to look at dry storage. I'll also have a look-see whether I can find some 6010s, perhaps thinner (1.5 mm?), or get some thicker metal scraps to work on.

Hi Mark

Try going to deltaschooloftrades.com for pracitce welding instruction and materal saving ideas.

Regards M J Mauer Andover, Ohio

Many thanks, Mike, I popped into the site quickly, and there's obviously a lot of info for me to digest.

You say you've got problems seeing the arc. I'd tackle this as a first priority. If you're not comfortable you won't get a decent weld and if you're not happy with your vision you won't be comfortable. Personally, I don't like the auto-darkening helmets because I don't feel I can see properly through them. Others love them. You might find a cheater lens works wonders, and, from my own bitter experience, I'd advise to set the helmet (fixed filters or auto-darkening) so it's too dark and then go lighter till you're happy with the result. (We've had some discussion on this topic at http://weldingweb.com/showthread.php?p= ... ost1407501 which might offer a few thoughts.)

Martin

And another thing, related to the current setting, remember Jody's rule of thumb: set the current so that the rod doesn't stick when you keep a close arc, and then keep a close arc.

Martin

Martin,

Your responses have been very valulable.

Re. seeing the arc, cheater lenses, etc.: I think that all the good videos, including Jody's, have spoilt me. I might consider buying myself some reading glasses (many pharmacies here carry them relatively cheaply) and wear them underneath the shield. My head-mounted shield has a fixed no. 9 or 10 lens. My hand-held shield has a no. 9. And all the spare lenses I've seen in the shops are also no. 9 or 10. I'll have to search some more, to try and find a no. 12...

Re. current: I've settled on about 100A for my 2.5 mm 6013 on DCEP. This keeps the rod from sticking. However, I'm still battling to strike the arc without sticking. (But that's a different matter, and not so relevant here.)

Keeping a close arc remains a challenge for me. Often I forget to feed the rod into the weld - I just want to pull it across. But I'll keep practising.

Cheers,
Mark

Hi Mark

Thanks for your kind comments; I'm pleased I've been of some help. Now, a couple of thoughts:

1. You are running your E6013s on reverse polarity, DC +ve; check the box the rods came in and see if DCEP is what the manufacturer recommends. E6013s are normally run on DCEN (straight polarity), but that's not to say your rods won't run on DCEP. Nevertheless, I wonder if the problem of the rod sticking is that you are on DCEP. Switch to DCEN and see if that's better. Try AC, too, if the manufacturer states (symbols on the side of the box) that they'll run on AC. (There's some discussion on DC polarity at http://forum.weldingtipsandtricks.com/v ... 2&start=10 if you want to delve a bit further.)

2. 100A for a 2.5mm rod seems possibly a bit on the high side but I realise you're trying to prevent the rod from sticking; see the range recommended on the side of the box. I wonder if the rod sticks because you've not quite mastered striking the arc. Once you've sorted the polarity to your satisfaction, just practice striking the arc on some scrap. You could try striking it like a match or another method is to peck the rod i.e. hit the workpiece and immediately lift off a wee bit (few mm) and then move back in. Till you get confident striking the arc, you could also have a bit of scrap next to your weld, strike up on that for a few seconds to get the rod hot them reposition the rod to your weld whilst it's still hot and strike up for your weld. It's less likely to stick when it's hot and your confidence gets a boost, soon you don't need the bit of scrap. (Make sure the scrap sits on the workpiece so it's earthed!)

3. A shade 9 is probably too light for 100A, and I've recently learned a valuable lesson that showed me I've been using filters that are too light. I'd now be using a shade 13 (gold covered) for 100A. You'd be amazed at how much more you can see with a darker shade - counter-intuitive, I know, but get some darker ones and experiment; not only do you see more but everything seems less violent so you feel much more in control - well, it works for me, anyway.

4. I don't know how reading glasses compare to cheater lenses, but it's a good starting point. You could try a couple to get a feel. I think I might have started with 3.00 reading glasses before moving to a 3.00 cheater. I now use Optivisor glass magnifers in my helmet. One thing to remember with either glasses or cheaters: they have an optimum focal distance and if you forget to keep your head moving to maintain that distance, you'll wonder why things are suddenly out of focus. Also remember that cheapo reading glasses are generally poor quality so if you find they help you might want to graduate onto a dedicated good quality glass cheater. (I don't really like the word "cheater"; it has negative implications, yet I'd recommend them even to someone with 20/20 vision.)

5. With a darker shade, the arc will seem less fierce and you should find it easier to keep a shorter arc because you've filtered out much of the glare..

6. You're on the right track - "But I'll keep practising" - practice makes perfect.

I'd be really interested to know how you get on especially if you find the darker filters beneficial.

Martin

You'll get there, Mark.

As for reading glasses, I do it all the time. I wear prescription glasses with progressive lenses most of the time, but under the hood, you'll always be within arm's length. Nearby is a "Dollar Tree" store, that sells everything, including reading glasses for a dollar. I usually buy $5 at a time (they're made cheap, obviously, so if I break one, who cares) in a few diopter ranges. I even have a pair of +3.50, that give me a headache if I don't take them off immediately, but allow me to see well when my hood is within, say, 30cm of the weld. I use +2.00 when the weld is at the end of my reach, about a metre. (That's 1 foot, and one yard, respectively, for those who, like me, were raised on imperial measurements.)

Steve

Hi Martin,

I've tried to read up as much as I could find on the 6013s and polarity. Apparently, they were originally developed for AC, but they can be operated on DCEN and DCEP as well. The manufacturer of my 6013s says the same thing on the package: suitable for all three set-ups. But if I remember correctly, they don't make any specific recommendation as to preferred DC polarity. I'll check the package again, though.

I haven't got access to AC, because my welder is a DC inverter. But I have actually tried my 6013s on both DCEP and DCEN. My impression, from my limited attempts, was that on DCEN, the arc wasn't as forgiving (tended to go out easier), and that the resulting bead wasn't as even/homogeneous. With DCEP, I observed somewhat more spatter, but I found the arc, once struck, to be more stable, and the bead was easier to get even. But that's only a first impression, obviously.

I've seen the thread on DC polarity, actually chimed in on it a few weeks ago, and read your answers with much interest.

Regarding current: my most "pleasant, groovy" welding was actually between 90 and 95A - more control, less spatter... But the arc-striking problems became worse. The rod manufacturer recommends, again if I remember correctly, a current of 60 - 100A. The welder manufacturer recommends 40 times the millimeter diameter, i.e. thousandths of inch. That would be 100A. But once I've improved my arc-strike, I'll definitely return to about 90A.

Well, enough written... and back to the rods.

Mark

Hi Mark

Thanks for the update. It's good that you are experimenting and making a note of the results. Remember that the experts tell us that the important thing is what works for you. So there may well be times when you discover something slightly unconventional that gives you good results (not only visually but also proven through testing. Before you know it, you'll start to chip in your two penneth (or two cents worth?) to the forums.

Martin

Here's some more feedback on my progress, and some questions...

My arc-striking has improved significantly after doing myself the favour of cleaning the scale off my angle iron (2.5 mm x 25 mm) with a grinding pad. Not that the angle iron was really all that dirty, but apparently, these 6013s don't like scale and even slight surface rust.

So I dialled my current down to about 85 amps on these 2.5 mm rods. That has given me some pretty decent beads on a flat. So, for that part, I'm happy. Occasionally, the rod still sticks on striking the arc, but I'll get there, I think.

Here's my next problem: I've been trying some corner welds by tacking two pieces of angle iron together edge-to-edge, so that they form a "+" shape. I then attempted to fill the two newly created corners. But try as I wanted, I couldn't get the arc into the corner. While welding, it looked as though the arc was in the corner, but I guess that was just slag. The bead deposited only on the one or the other side of the corner. Sometimes, it actually deposited on both sides simultaneously, with a gap inbetween, through which I can still see the corner. The bead hardly ever filled the corner. Only in some instances did it bridge across from one bead to the other. I really tried to push the rod right into the corner, but to no avail. I also tried a higher current (about 95 A), but if anything, this only made things worse: thicker beads on either side of the corner, more spatter, less control. I also tried different drag angles. A steeper angle tended to make the molten slag run in front of the arc, so I tended to go with a flatter angle, to "blow" the slag back. But still, the actual bead didn't form in the corner. I also tried a weaving motion, like a series of cursive e's or u's. That didn't help either.

Even the tack welds were problematic. I had to try several times before the tack actually melted into both plates.

I did use clamps to make sure that before placing the tack welds, there is good electrical contact between the two pieces of angle iron. And the quality of the beads is similar on both pieces, so the problem is not related to badly connected pieces (I think).

The only thing I've not tried yet, is switching to DCEN. I'm still working on DCEP, as I did for the flat welds.

I've taken some pictures, but unfortunately don't have my camera with me. I'll try to show them tomorrow. In the meantime, can anyone help on the basis of my description? This is really frustrating!

Is my assembly, with two pieces of angle iron mounted angle-to-angle, perhaps part of the problem?

Cheers,
Mark

Right, so here are my pictures.

*trembling*

Corner weld between two pieces of angle iron (thickness 2.5 mm or 0.1", side length 25 mm or 1"), tacked together angle-to-angle. DCEP, 85A, rods: Eurasia 6013, 2.5 mm / 0.1". Top of picture is blacked out because it shows a flat weld irrelevant to the corner weld.


Corner weld on opposite corner, with current increased to 90A.


Flat weld with settings as previously. 85A. Corner weld is blacked out because it's irrelevant here.


I tried a similar flat weld with DCEN (straight polarity), and right off the beat, I battled to strike an arc and keep it going. It was slightly better at 90A, but still the arc went out and stuck the rod to the work. These rods definitely handle better at DCEP.

So, I'm on my way with flat welds, but what about those corner welds?

[Edit: updated links that had changed.]

in the corners i climb both walls of the "V" just enough to get a good foothold of the walls 1/8"in stick 3/16 climb and weave back and forth from "wall to wall" the root pass is kinda big in the "x box" as we call it in my tech school but it gives me more to grab too on the next 2 passes as long as i dont build the middle of the bead up too far

Thanks, then I'll try more of a weaving motion the next time.

In your experience, does it make a difference whether there is a small gap at the foot of the "V", or whether the "V" is completely closed? I'm just wondering what's the best position for tacking my two pieces together.

well if its just a practice piece i would tack them at a 90* dump those 6013 grab a few 7018s or 9018s and get comfortable running those first (thats just personal tho) run the root and maybe the next 2 with the 70s and then once i got out a few runs change back to the 60s. i say this because i am a beginner also (i just completed stick in my local tech school and have moved on to overload myself with a healthy dose of MIG and TIG) and i had a little trouble with the 60s stacking the bead rather than weaving like with the 70s and 90s. the 60s dont run as hot and move slower that might have been my issue with them speed come to think of it......and i am in no way opposed to being corrected by any of the board elders if i am steering this fine gent wrong in any way.......

[img]F:\DCIM\100PHOTO[/img]
lets see if i can post a picture....(wheres my "computer for idiots" book) this is my "MIG" x box but it shows a 90 being filled up with beads

The 6013 in the corners looks way to cold. However, 6013 does that. I've seen a video of Jody welding 6013 that leaves a gap down the middle. It has happened to me as well in the rare times that 6013 has been used.

Like the others on here stated, 7014 would be your best bet for a rod for training. It doesn't require a dry environment, is easy to strike, and lays down an attractive bead. 7018 will be a easy transition once the 7014 is mastered.

Without sounding too harsh - dump the 6013 for a while. If you must use a 60xx rod then 6011 would be better. Easy arc strikes, hard to stick, good penetration, will run on DC. It won't give the prettiest welds but they will work.

And there exactly lies my problem, gentlemen!

I'd gladly buy other rods if I could, but I've been to numerous suppliers, and 6013 is literally the only electrode I can find here! It appears to be the "norm" here in South Africa. (From what I've read, there seems to be a similar situation in the United Kingdom.) By the way, my welder is a DC inverter, so I'd have to use 6010s, not 6011s. But that's a moot point anyway, because I haven't seen either of them here.

So, unless I find a specialty supplier, I'll have to stick (pun intended) with the 6013s... Even though blaming them makes me feel a bit better, I still have to work with them. What's a man to do?

@ semi:
You first have to upload your image to a hosting server, e.g. Picasa Web Albums, and then post a link to the picture's URL here in the forum.

Just to note - 6011 works very well on a DC inverter. I use a 200 amp DC inverter and use 6011 for almost every root pass on farm jobs. Then 7018 is used as the filler.

Hard to believe that 6013 is the only rod available to you in S.A. It is just not a satisfactory rod for any kind of heavy metal work. But if you say it is so then I'll believe it. My sympathies.

You may want to go to a welding shop where they actually weld (not a retailer) and ask them what they use and how to get a different rod. I'd bet that they use something other than 6013.

OK, here are some distributors in SA that can set you up with 7018. You were correct in that rod availability is very limited for some reason.

7018 does not have to be kept bone dry for non-code work. It will work just fine unless it is soaked. You can even dry it out in the oven or a large covered electric fry pan (14" diagonal).

http://www.weldcut.co.za/stick-welding.htm

http://www.mainweldingsuppliessa.co.za/ ... duct+Range

GWD,

Thanks for the additional info. I like the idea of asking the people working in a welding shop which rods they work with, and where they get them. I work at a research institute with several workshops (including welders) on campus. They should know...

And thanks for the heads-up on 6011 with DC.

and ps ...... 7018 comes in dc AND ac only....there was a hard learned lesson for me.....