316l Electrode questions + others

RTFabrications · Sun Jun 14, 2015 6:41 pm

Hey everyone, I have an issue and along the process of explaining it i might have a few questions. please bear with the structure of this as i am not always the best as keeping continuity while writing.

i can lay very nice beads with 6011 (my favorite rod) and 6013 (i use for decorative purposes or drawing on steel)
but..am having issues with ....stainless, before we get to that however:

I have my workshop roughly 125 feet from the 20 amp breaker that is supplying power to it.
I was a child when the power was ran to the shop, i don't know the gauge that was used.

I am using an 80amp DC arc welder and striking arcs with 1/16 CARBON steel electrodes never seems to be an issue, the puddle is brilliant white, and bites deep.
When using 3/32 rods, they STICK....they barely arc, and are un-usable.

Obviously an 80 amp DC can handle a 3/32 rod on 1/8'' steel however, I am suspecting that my welder is STARVING due to the 125 feet of wire it has to go through. I do "think" I recall using a 3/32 rod when i first worked with my old 70 amp welder plugged directly into the house and i was able to lay a bead with it somewhat, when i moved into the shop, that same rod would no longer lay a bead.

Does it sound likely that a larger rod would force the welder to admit it was starving while the thinner 1/16s will cooperate and deceive you into thinking everything was ok? Being that the 1/16'' electrodes work perfectly i just assumed the proper voltage was getting to the welder.

now on to the Stainless question, this one is most important and i suppose ties into the situation already mentioned.

I need to get into stainless stick welding, its the final step for my products, I am determined to make this happen.

I purchased some VERY cheap (10.92 per LB) 1/16'' 316L electrodes from Zoro.com.
i mention this because at first i thought because they were cheaper china made rods, that was the issue.

the amperage listing on the package is a modest 30-50 (SAME AS MY HOBART 1/16'' rods)
HOWEVER....these Stainless rods, stick often, AND...the puddle seems more orange and dim than brilliant white, and my welder is CRANKED to 80.
i am able to lay a bead with them on a flat piece of steel dragging them slowly.
the bear is TALL, nowhere near as low profile as my 6011 or 13s telling me is a cold weld?
finally...i never encountered this before but when i add the part to the plate i want to join and try welding again with the stainless the bead globs in some areas and doesn't even wet in others!
it will "appear" that the puddle is doing its thing, however after chipping off the slag, i notice that A LOT of areas i went over DID NOT even get a bead at all, rather other areas got a GLOB of stainless on them, in the end both pieces are not joined, the rod material actually chose one of the parts but not BOTH to bond.

I was told that Stainless rods are a WHOLE new can of worms and that they require A LOT more amperage.

ok i hope this thread is fairly easy enough to follow along to. I feel that the answers i get here will greatly educate me and bring me one step further.

Thanks in advance for any help you can voice.

ldbtx · Sun Jun 14, 2015 7:55 pm

I'll guarantee you that you're not getting full voltage out at the shop. Even if the circuit was run with 12 AWG, appropriate for the 20 amp breaker, at that distance and trying to pull full current you'll have serious voltage drop. If it can be done, I'd suggest upgrading the wiring.

RTFabrications · Sun Jun 14, 2015 8:08 pm

ldbtx wrote:I'll guarantee you that you're not getting full voltage out at the shop. Even if the circuit was run with 12 AWG, appropriate for the 20 amp breaker, at that distance and trying to pull full current you'll have serious voltage drop. If it can be done, I'd suggest upgrading the wiring.

Thanks for the quick reply.
I have no doubts now.

I dont really have the option of running new line however..a new option was mentioned to me and that is to tap off the 220 line which is much closer to the shop (about 30 feet tops) and once its installed in the shop, buy a converter that turns the 220 port into 2 110 (20/15 amp) outlets. I wouldn't mind having a 220 in there if i ever upgrade to a 220 welder at least i would have the option.

ill have to hire an electrician, honestly anything other than wiring up motion lights is something im concerned to do.

at least much of this mystery is over with, the welder is starving lol.

TRACKRANGER · Mon Jun 15, 2015 1:00 am

If you can connect a multimeter set to AC volts into a power outlet on the same circuit and adjacent (as close as possible) to the welder, and get someone to watch the voltage reading as you weld, you'll be able to identify the extent of the voltage drop, and see exactly what primary volts you're actually getting to the machine.

RTFabrications · Mon Jun 15, 2015 10:04 am

TRACKRANGER wrote:If you can connect a multimeter set to AC volts into a power outlet on the same circuit and adjacent (as close as possible) to the welder, and get someone to watch the voltage reading as you weld, you'll be able to identify the extent of the voltage drop, and see exactly what primary volts you're actually getting to the machine.

ahh i never thought to do that! very nice

TRACKRANGER · Mon Jun 15, 2015 10:44 am

And welcome aboard. This is really a great forum. Everyone contributes, shares and helps wherever they can.

Trev

RTFabrications · Mon Jun 15, 2015 2:02 pm

TRACKRANGER wrote:And welcome aboard. This is really a great forum. Everyone contributes, shares and helps wherever they can.

Trev

thanks! i can tell i will learn a lot as well already

RTFabrications · Mon Jun 15, 2015 7:52 pm

ldbtx wrote:I'll guarantee you that you're not getting full voltage out at the shop. Even if the circuit was run with 12 AWG, appropriate for the 20 amp breaker, at that distance and trying to pull full current you'll have serious voltage drop. If it can be done, I'd suggest upgrading the wiring.

220 is now installed! =) I am waiting for the adapter to come in the mail then ill be able to test the system. First thing im going to do is see if i can use 3/32 rods. for the sake of archiving the information acquired ill post my results.

ldbtx · Mon Jun 15, 2015 7:55 pm

RTFabrications wrote:
ldbtx wrote:I'll guarantee you that you're not getting full voltage out at the shop. Even if the circuit was run with 12 AWG, appropriate for the 20 amp breaker, at that distance and trying to pull full current you'll have serious voltage drop. If it can be done, I'd suggest upgrading the wiring.
220 is now installed! =) I am waiting for the adapter to come in the mail then ill be able to test the system. First thing im going to do is see if i can use 3/32 rods. for the sake of archiving the information acquired ill post my results.

Glad you were able to get the upgrade done so quickly. You should be welding soon, with considerably more satisfactory results.

LDB