[brokeitagain]

beating my head against a wall trying to tig, asked for help from buddies that say they know how to, they all want money to assist me so i suppose they aren't really buddies

[Superiorwelding]

beating my head against a wall trying to tig, asked for help from buddies that say they know how to, they all want money to assist me so i suppose they aren't really buddies

What help do you need? What's that song " you find out who your friends are..."
-Jonathan

[MinnesotaDave]

beating my head against a wall trying to tig, asked for help from buddies that say they know how to, they all want money to assist me so i suppose they aren't really buddies

Don't worry, as soon as you learn how they'll want you to weld their stuff and be your buddie again

Post some pics and questions - good help to be had here

[brokeitagain]

maybe its the beer and im venting lol. no pics, yet but I seem to be over cooking my welds. too little amperage and too much dwell time (spending too much time on a bead), and I can not manage to keep a tungsten out of the puddle, when I dip a tungsten what is the correct way to get a stuck one out? full amps and twist or stop amperage and twist out? I always grind tungsten out after a catastrophic stick

[Superiorwelding]

maybe its the beer and im venting lol. no pics, yet but I seem to be over cooking my welds. too little amperage and too much dwell time (spending too much time on a bead), and I can not manage to keep a tungsten out of the puddle, when I dip a tungsten what is the correct way to get a stuck one out? full amps and twist or stop amperage and twist out? I always grind tungsten out after a catastrophic stick

What you are describing is something that will improve with hood time. To try to help, move faster and maybe try dipping more, this will cool you weld down and not look so bad.
Dipping the tungsten is something I was talking to a friend about today. He came over and I welded some cast alum for him and dipped my tungsten while he was watching. I told him I have heard those who say they never dip their tungsten, well my friend that is just not true. You may go a year without dipping but it will happen.
As far as a stuck tungsten, maxing our amperage will do nothing as there will be no arc initiated when you smash the pedal. My best way so far is to take the tungsten out of the torch and break it as close as possible to the material. If it were a critical weld I would recommend grinding it all out. I know this weld is just for practice, but you may as well learn how to do this now.
Get some pictures up and we will all be here to help you out.
-Jonathan

[brokeitagain]

I will get a few pics up this week, I have depleted another 125 cu ft cylinder. I think did better before I got a foot pedal though, but with an on/off switch I cant control it when I know it is too hot

[Superiorwelding]

I will get a few pics up this week, I have depleted another 125 cu ft cylinder. I think did better before I got a foot pedal though, but with an on/off switch I cant control it when I know it is too hot

Look forward to seeing the pics. A snap start or on off switch is not the best way to learn, in my opinion. It can and does teach you how to move, what different dipping rates do to your weld puddle and what to much heat does to the weld, but there is obviously no amperage control that is needed when learning.
-Jonathan

[TamJeff]

Snap start isn't the best way to learn by one's self, but someone who knows can teach someone to make presentable beads with one in a couple hours time, with AC on aluminum at least. The trick is to use it to break down the physical components of the weld. From puddle formation, timing, torch angle correction and filler placement and perspective with regard to position. The switch allows one to be able to analyze the whole process, one puddle at a time. From there, pulse each puddle on top of the other with precise placement of the torch between strikes. It's like being able to let off the throttle before the crash occurs when the car has started to lose control. Soon, the manual pulses become quicker intervals until they are getting multiple puddles before turning the switch off.

I have taught a LOT of people to TIG weld aluminum in this way. Most have no issue then moving on to the foot pedal, having gained that kind of familiarity with what is going on with the actual weld puddle.

Used to be that you gained your practice as a "tacker." The switch method of learning is essentially the same exercise. Just helps to have someone experienced looking over your shoulder telling you what to look for with enough time to let you see it.

After I have shown people the breakdown, they were astonished that they had not seen it as it occurs like that before, as if in slow motion. You can then get them to notice other things such as, joint configuration effect on the arc stream, as well as how adding filler effects it and what to look for when the filler starts filling and getting closer to the tungsten.

Think of using the switch as 'time lapse' photography. Each puddle a picture taken every few seconds and your brain eventually running them altogether into one continuous weld, for lack of a better explanation. You can also learn this way with a pedal. Basically, all you need to be able to do to start is learn to strike an arc and form one single puddle. Also an excellent way to learn to weld large gaps and vertical up, or, large gaps vertical up!

[MinnesotaDave]

I will get a few pics up this week, I have depleted another 125 cu ft cylinder.

Don't worry about learning fast, this is a long, long process.

After about 100 hours tig welding different positions and thicknesses - and welding steel and aluminum - you'll start feeling pretty comfortable and pick up skills quicker.

Keep in mind, people go to school for quite a while to learn this - on your own takes at least as long.

[cornmuse]

" you find out who your friends are..."
-Jonathan

"Friends help you move, real friends help you move the body"

[Oscar]

I learned TIG on my own and from watching youtube videos, since I don't know anyone who I could learn from. So it's possible (not that I'm a good welder or anything), but I've made some useful stuff over the years. The best thing to get help on forums is to disclose everything up-front because it will save you and us a LOT of time

Amperage:
Tungsten blend/size:
Filler rod type/size:
Argon Flow CFH:
AC balance (if applicable):
Pulse (if applicable):
EP/EN currents/ratios (if applicable):
material thickness:
pre-weld prep routine:
torch size/style + air or water cooled:
collet body style:
cup style:
tungsten stickout:
Tungsten taper:
pre-flow seconds:
post-flow seconds:
picture of your sharpened tungsten:
PICTURES/videos of: parts fit-up, torch angle, travel direction, speed descriptions:

[Superiorwelding]

I learned TIG on my own and from watching youtube videos, since I don't know anyone who I could learn from. So it's possible (not that I'm a good welder or anything), but I've made some useful stuff over the years. The best thing to get help on forums is to disclose everything up-front because it will save you and us a LOT of time

Amperage:
Tungsten blend/size:
Filler rod type/size:
Argon Flow CFH:
AC balance (if applicable):
Pulse (if applicable):
EP/EN currents/ratios (if applicable):
material thickness:
pre-weld prep routine:
torch size/style + air or water cooled:
collet body style:
cup style:
tungsten stickout:
Tungsten taper:
pre-flow seconds:
post-flow seconds:
picture of your sharpened tungsten:
PICTURES/videos of: parts fit-up, torch angle, travel direction, speed descriptions:

That looks like a great list and indeed would help us all out in answering questions. I can't help to think just filling out the list honestly will help ones self in diagnosing a problem. There is Something about laying the facts in front of you and looking at it from that different able. Thanks for the list.
-Jonathan

[Oscar]

That looks like a great list and indeed would help us all out in answering questions. I can't help to think just filling out the list honestly will help ones self in diagnosing a problem. There is Something about laying the facts in front of you and looking at it from that different able. Thanks for the list.
-Jonathan

that's exactly what it's for---so other's can get a complete picture of what's going on (the most important part being the actual pictures, since in 2014, there is little to no excuse for not being able to post up pictures if you can get to this forum from a computer )

[Bill Beauregard]

I assume you're welding steel if you stick the tungsten. I've never stuck a tungsten. I've done mostly aluminum. Dipping tungsten is frustrating. propping to steady your hand is invaluable. I love Jody Collier's TIG fingers from the Weld Monger Store. Sometimes I have to improvise a clamp or some other device to rest and steady your hand. A sniper finds a way to rest the gun, they are sufficiently steady to kill a mile away!
watch your puddle, after a clean, shiny pool forms move back slightly to avoid the rod and dip the filler rod, pull the rod back 1/2" and advance the torch to the leading edge of the puddle. Each filler rod dip will chill the puddle, like an ice cube in boiling water, Use this phenomenon to keep your metal from overheating. A rule of thumb is 1 amp per .001" thickness. less if it's thicker. Use the foot pedal to reduce the heat if it is too much. Keep a short arc near perpendicular to the weld bead, with practice, tungsten diameter, beginner a bit more. Bring filler in 90 degrees to the torch, between dips of filler pull it back just far enough to prevent it from melting.
Get a bigger tank. In my world a cubic foot costs more in a little tank, and they run out more often. By the time you are proficient you'll use quite a few large tanks full.
Try to be patient. It doesn't come quickly, but like golf it can be addictive, and for the rest of your life you'll keep getting better.

[Superiorwelding]

I assume you're welding steel if you stick the tungsten. I've never stuck a tungsten. I've done mostly aluminum. Dipping tungsten is frustrating. propping to steady your hand is invaluable. I love Jody Collier's TIG fingers from the Weld Monger Store. Sometimes I have to improvise a clamp or some other device to rest and steady your hand. A sniper finds a way to rest the gun, they are sufficiently steady to kill a mile away!
watch your puddle, after a clean, shiny pool forms move back slightly to avoid the rod and dip the filler rod, pull the rod back 1/2" and advance the torch to the leading edge of the puddle. Each filler rod dip will chill the puddle, like an ice cube in boiling water, Use this phenomenon to keep your metal from overheating. A rule of thumb is 1 amp per .001" thickness. less if it's thicker. Use the foot pedal to reduce the heat if it is too much. Keep a short arc near perpendicular to the weld bead, with practice, tungsten diameter, beginner a bit more. Bring filler in 90 degrees to the torch, between dips of filler pull it back just far enough to prevent it from melting.
Get a bigger tank. In my world a cubic foot costs more in a little tank, and they run out more often. By the time you are proficient you'll use quite a few large tanks full.
Try to be patient. It doesn't come quickly, but like golf it can be addictive, and for the rest of your life you'll keep getting better.

The last time I stuck my tungsten, it was on cast aluminum. It can happen with any material. You do have a valid point on the larger bottle and being patient. I will admit I am not always the most patient and when TIG gets frustrating I just have to walk away for a while and come back when I have a cleared head.
-Jonathan

[Mike]

Good list missed materal type.

[Bill Beauregard]

" you find out who your friends are..."
-Jonathan

"Friends help you move, real friends help you move the body"

I'm starting to like the way you think.

[mcoe]

I am still learning tig and have been since around Christmas time and until about three weeks ago I dipped the tungsten on every other bead and now I haven't until the other day I got stuck, tried breaking it off close to the metal like someone mentioned and when to grind it and it exploded on me. I guess I cracked it.
I watched every video on tig I could find and that helped me start. A lot of helmet time really helps. I have emptied two 80 cuft bottles just practicing and playing. My wife had no trouble picking it up because she watched all the videos with me. They really do help.

[Superiorwelding]

I am still learning tig and have been since around Christmas time and until about three weeks ago I dipped the tungsten on every other bead and now I haven't until the other day I got stuck, tried breaking it off close to the metal like someone mentioned and when to grind it and it exploded on me. I guess I cracked it.

Define "exploded on you" I have never had that happen, but mine was in aluminum.
Edit: I just re-read that post, what I did not include it I used a die grinder. Send me a bill for whatever you broke.
-Jonathan

[mcoe]

I bent it close to the metal and broke it loose and when I went to sharpen it as soon as it touched the wheel it peeled back and since I had it spinning in a drill send pieces of tungsten all over the place and put a hole in my grinding wheel. All is well other than the fact it was a fresh tungsten that I just sharpened and when I started welding I had one of those sneezes that just sneak up and hit ya and drove the tungsten right into the puddle after about an inch. It was bad. My wife yelled at me for wasting it but other than that all is well.

[Superiorwelding]

I bent it close to the metal and broke it loose and when I went to sharpen it as soon as it touched the wheel it peeled back and since I had it spinning in a drill send pieces of tungsten all over the place and put a hole in my grinding wheel. All is well other than the fact it was a fresh tungsten that I just sharpened and when I started welding I had one of those sneezes that just sneak up and hit ya and drove the tungsten right into the puddle after about an inch. It was bad. My wife yelled at me for wasting it but other than that all is well.

Yea, now I feel even worse. I normally either break off all of the contaminated part or grind slowly straight on the wheel until I reach good tungsten. I guess I should explain what I am doing better.
Edit: Grinding it straight on is likely why tungsten exploded.
-Jonathan

[mcoe]

That's what happened I was grinding straight on and that is when it exploded. Don't feel bad I just read your comments and this happened last week.

[MinnesotaDave]

Since you are new to tig, I think every pic I've seen of tungsten grinding shows the wheel turning at you (tungsten pointed into the rotation of the wheel).

This is against safety rules for grinding anything - if it catches on the wheel it can send tungsten through your hand.

Point the tungsten down (wheel turning away from the piece being ground) for safety.

I know it's harder to see that way, but it's safer

I know of some welders who took the guard off the grinder and turned it around so they can grind on top of the wheel with it spinning away from them.

[Bill Beauregard]

Dave,
An old builder I worked with for 19 years was famous for inhuman feats of human endurance. He'd frame a house as quickly in winter as summer, quicker, lest someone suggest winter wasn't a good time to start a project. His doctor said he should wear a back brace. He replied: "People need to think I'm superman. If I wear a back brace they'll see me as more of an invalid." He is best known for roofing in a snow storm, clapboarding under the eaves of a two story colonial in a cold November rain. I don't think he owned a jacket, just ten layers of wool shirts and pants. His most often repeated remark was: "There's no need to turn this into a project! We ain't building a piano here!" His record was a 28' x 54' raised ranch with finished walk out basement, he the only carpenter. It was move in ready in 21 days! That's 3 seven day weeks 11 hour days!

[MinnesotaDave]

Bill - were you in the mood to mildly ramble about the past or were you making a point this evening?

If my description of grinding tungsten safely was overly long, that's ok. I don't mind being poked fun over it.
I'd rather be accused of being long winded on safety than not let a new guy know about a potential injury that's easily prevented and often overlooked