ESENTI wrote:oscar there was a problem with link so i sent you a picture instead
That does not work for a standard 9/20 series gas lens, therefore it does not work with the stubby 17/26 that the OP originally inquired about. That cup and anything else from that 53NXX series works for large gas lenses that are 1" in diameter(the standard gas lens for 9/20 and stubby-17 series is roughly 1/2" in diameter). Luckily those cups work with the large gas lenses from both 9/20 and 17/26 series. I own and use them.
Same cup featured here, which is where I obtained mine.
The 53N88, which is the #10 version, is identical in that it screws onto the 1"-16TPI threads of a large diameter gas lens collet body that is 1" diam.
Also, you can't "protect" the screen. If you run into gunky metal that spatters when you weld over it for whatever reason, if it gunks up the screen, you can either try to meticulously replace the screens, or simply throw out the whole gas lens collet body, as the entire thing is meant to be a consumable over the long-term.
Oscar, that is a helluva offer but right now I'll hold off see how this Ti thing goes. Thank you very much, one reason I really like this forum, great group of guys.
What Smithy did you get? I've looked at them as well, used a Granite model to flycut some pistons, very smooth and worked well. Smithy is only about an hour and a half away from me.
I weld stainless, stainless and more stainless...Food Industry, sanitary process piping, vessels, whatever is needed, I like to make stuff.
ASME IX, AWS 17.1, D1.1
Instagram #RNHFAB
Dear Oscar , thank you for the very informative reply , obviously I made a mistake which i tried to correct by an email i sent
them to replace the nozzles with something else .
Rick_H wrote:Oscar, that is a helluva offer but right now I'll hold off see how this Ti thing goes. Thank you very much, one reason I really like this forum, great group of guys.
What Smithy did you get? I've looked at them as well, used a Granite model to flycut some pistons, very smooth and worked well. Smithy is only about an hour and a half away from me.
I ended up ordering a 1220LTD. They had free shipping, so I couldn't resist to get my beak wet in the world of machining. I know the machine has limitations, but luckily I found a few videos on youtube outlining ways to get around some of those limitations. I do only hobby automotive type stuff, so I don't need aerospace tolerances. Hope to have it up and running in about two weeks or however long it takes to get here. Can't wait.
There are a remarkable number of options for the small gas lens in the 9/20 size.
Dogfab sells glass pyrex cups in a variety of sizes from size 5 to about size 15 for the 9/20 size torch. His stuff is excellent, with custom diffusers available for the 12 and 15 sizes. You can see and buy them here: http://www.dogfab.com/FURICK_CUPS.php
cdaven271 on instagram is a masterful TIG welder who sells large Ti cups, complete with insulators, that fit the 9/20 gas lens. You can see his work and his cups on instagram under @cdaven271
Colin from toxicab.com also sells large cups with custom diffusers that fit the 9/20 cup size. They are pricey, but probably reflects the time it takes to make them in small quantities. I think the name of his internet sales store is radweldingsupplies.com
If you don't have to use the smaller gas lens size, the least expensive option with high gas coverage are the large, stubby lenses which are at least twice the size through the lens as the 9/20 sizes provide. The cups are the same inside diameter as the outside diameter of the gas lens, so there is low turbulance and very good gas coverage. I fashioned an even larger cup setup from a 12 size cup by making minor modifications to the gas lens (removing some of the threads) and insulator, which allowed me to screw the cup onto the gas lens reversing the usual orientation of the cup to have the largest end away from the lens. Here are a couple pics to show you what it looks like.
Mr. Moose,
I emailed (Cdaven) Chris Davenport quite awhile ago and asked how I could go about buying one of the Titanium cups and never got a return email with an answer, not sure what gives. If somebody has a way to buy these cups from him, that's something I'd be interested in.
Toxicfab is very proud of his stuff and wants way more for 'consumables' than I care to spend. I think most of these guys have become Instagram famous and others think if they pay double for some fancy cup that they'll all of a sudden weld like Collin, I have no such illusions. A $150 cup will not make me weld most things that I weld one cent worth better.
Dogfab on the other hand seems to respond to emails and has good customer service for a reasonably priced line of Pyrex cups. I think his Titanium band that goes around the larger cup is pretty cool too.
I'm not bagging you for the suggestions, just my opinion of them.
Before I even knew about all the people making Ti cups I thought about seeing how much my machinist would charge to make custom cups. I always wanted to make a large billet gas lens with the trailing shield built in out of Ti, alum or copper. There are manufacturers that make custom cups like this but when I contacted them a while back there was a min order and they were VERY expensive. Maybe I can get some Ti cups made and become a Instagram star too
I am, however, working on a copper cup, might have it done tomorrow.
-Jonathan
Mr. Moose wrote:There are a remarkable number of options for the small gas lens in the 9/20 size.
Dogfab sells glass pyrex cups in a variety of sizes from size 5 to about size 15 for the 9/20 size torch. His stuff is excellent, with custom diffusers available for the 12 and 15 sizes. You can see and buy them here: http://www.dogfab.com/FURICK_CUPS.php
Pretty cool! The CK #18 (large pyrex cup) kit isn't too bad either.
Mr Moose , can you say a little more about the #12 cup how you do it please since I want to make it myself. For Oscar looks a nice combo machinery I bet it will be very useful .
Superiorwelding wrote:Before I even knew about all the people making Ti cups I thought about seeing how much my machinist would charge to make custom cups. I always wanted to make a large billet gas lens with the trailing shield built in out of Ti, alum or copper. There are manufacturers that make custom cups like this but when I contacted them a while back there was a min order and they were VERY expensive. Maybe I can get some Ti cups made and become a Instagram star too
I am, however, working on a copper cup, might have it done tomorrow.
-Jonathan
Why copper? Why use one of the best thermal conductors for a cup when the whole point of cups and Teflon gaskets is to minimize heat transfer to the torch body?
Oscar wrote:
Why copper? Why use one of the best thermal conductors for a cup when the whole point of cups and Teflon gaskets is to minimize heat transfer to the torch body?
I was going to suggest possibly inconel, found this chart; 304 stainless has the same value. Cheaper and a lot easier to obtain.
Superiorwelding wrote:Before I even knew about all the people making Ti cups I thought about seeing how much my machinist would charge to make custom cups. I always wanted to make a large billet gas lens with the trailing shield built in out of Ti, alum or copper. There are manufacturers that make custom cups like this but when I contacted them a while back there was a min order and they were VERY expensive. Maybe I can get some Ti cups made and become a Instagram star too
I am, however, working on a copper cup, might have it done tomorrow.
-Jonathan
Why copper? Why use one of the best thermal conductors for a cup when the whole point of cups and Teflon gaskets is to minimize heat transfer to the torch body?
Because it looks cool! Just messing around in shop. I know it is not economical.
-Jonathan
Actually one of the biggest reasons for using alumina, lava, Pyrex is . . . it is NON CONDUCTIVE. If you have a conductive cup and cup touches any part of what you are welding on the cup will try and weld itself to the work. The protective band that the one guy uses works cause it is slipped over a non conductive cup. His band never makes actual contact with collet body like an all metal cup will
Last edited by dirtmidget33 on Sat Jan 03, 2015 5:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
why use standard nozzles after gas lens where invented. Kinda of like starting fires by rubbing sticks together.
If you look at I believe it toxicfab with the titanium tube it appears there is an insulator between the thread section and actual metal cup. If there wasn't cup would be useless for welding on frames and tight places. lot cheaper to use the CK large diameter alumina push on cups with gas saver lenses without all the hassle of dealing with the metal cups
why use standard nozzles after gas lens where invented. Kinda of like starting fires by rubbing sticks together.
@ESENTI just a word of caution and advice take it for what its worth on your new CK gas lens kit you order. I use those alumina cups with my gas lenses too along with the pyrex. The actual gas lens fits very tight into the cup so you cant just push them on, but have to use a twisting motion. This tightens the lens on to the collet body quite a bit more than I would normally tighten them. So after removing the cup the lens can be very hard to remove by hand have found it helpful to keep a wrench that fits the lens in my box.
So remember when you put on these cups
cups.jpg (19.41 KiB) Viewed 1488 times
it tightens this lens
screen.jpg (38.62 KiB) Viewed 1488 times
onto this collet body and torch quite a bit
colletbody.jpg (36.67 KiB) Viewed 1488 times
The lens has flat spots on them so you can use a wrench to remove them. The Pyrex being smoother inside doesn't have this issues as bad. I have also had to increase my argon flow more than with a normal gas lens.
ESENTI these things are huge they look smaller in pics, when you mount it on torch it will prolly surprise you how big they are. Enjoy them they are pretty cool to work with. Plus all you have to buy is the different lenses and collets to get the other sizes once you have base and washer.
P.S. I apologize for not putting this in one long post kept getting interrupted while trying to post today
why use standard nozzles after gas lens where invented. Kinda of like starting fires by rubbing sticks together.
wayyyy to lengthy for my small hands. It would take me too much effort to contort my wrist to keep that cup from dragging on the work. A [much] shorter version would be nice
Oscar,
I was originally going to use a 1" copper cap to make is shorter but that would require drilling out the back and the coupler was a few cents cheaper. Seriously, I decided on this because it is actually the exact length of the Pyrex cup so I knew all the pieces would fit. The gas lens will actually fit inside of the copper pipe as well I just didn't put it in.
-Jonathan
Superiorwelding wrote:Oscar,
I was originally going to use a 1" copper cap to make is shorter but that would require drilling out the back and the coupler was a few cents cheaper. Seriously, I decided on this because it is actually the exact length of the Pyrex cup so I knew all the pieces would fit. The gas lens will actually fit inside of the copper pipe as well I just didn't put it in.
-Jonathan
Exact length of which pyrex cup? Not the CK #18 pyrex cup.
it is way shorter than that BBQ grill, I mean copper pipe you used
@dirtmidget33 i do appreciate your suggestions , that's the spirit lets call our site forum of virtue , In my work i do repairs which is more difficult than running seems in a routine say production line .Some bits are small this means a lot of empty space around which means oxidation . So I thought a large diameter protective gas might help . ( this Saturday I extend the fin side of a aluminum small helicopter toy and I had to go several times over the to both sides and It affected the appearance of the finished weld ).
Large gas diameter has its place in the 'quiver' of welders.I never had one but after some thought I decided to get one.
I am worried if it will withstand extensive high amperage use ? but I will keep an eye on it to see how it goes.
