Welding Tips and Tricks

They just keep releasing more and more bada*# machines! Looks like this one is the little brother of the Invertig 400, and the big brother of the 221! From their website (features look identical to the 400, except that it tops out at 300A).

HTP Invertig 313 AC/DC

A typo that I keep seeing, at least on the 400, is the AC Frequency. If it is identical to the 400, it should read: 20-400Hz (up to 99A), 20-200Hz (over 99A). Also, not sure what is a "23-series" TIG torch, maybe a typo.







No, I will not be buying one, lol.

Is that more or less street price shown there or can they be had for less buying elsewhere?

I think there's a couple dealers for HTP here and there across the country, but I doubt their pricing will be much different.

I was just curious. Like with the Miller stuff, Miller says one thing, Cyberweld says another...

BugHunter wrote:I was just curious. Like with the Miller stuff, Miller says one thing, Cyberweld says another...

Yea I hear ya. But HTP is small-time (business-wise) compared to Miller. The machines do pack a powerful punch though!

Very nice. Seems like a good move to have an in-between unit like that. They had made a big jump going from the 221 to the 400. That'll be attractive for customers like me that are looking for machines in the 300 amp range.

That's odd on the frequency restrictions based upon amperage... is your 221 and 400 the same? I never realized they had that limitation

cj737 wrote:That's odd on the frequency restrictions based upon amperage... is your 221 and 400 the same? I never realized they had that limitation

The 221 is completely different; it goes from 20-200Hz. On the 400, it's not a limitation of the machine per-say, it's just decision made by Stel in the programming. They could have not created that "step" if they chose.

If they had mentioned it or put information out on it 5 or 6 weeks ago, I might have waited and gotten just that instead of the 2 Miller machines I have. No real regrets for me because that thing is so heavy and I don't mind having the light MIG that I can take out to the detached garage we're building. Still, Jeff should be able to do better getting the word out. I even spoke with him a week or so ago and he didn't mention it, so now I have a Dynasty 210 DX... .

It looks really nice. Betting it will give the Dynasty 280 a run for the money!

cj737 wrote:That's odd on the frequency restrictions based upon amperage... is your 221 and 400 the same? I never realized they had that limitation

I wouldn't really call it a limitaion. 400hz sounds so annoying you can't stand to use it.

Really though, I was just welding at 200hz a few minutes ago and seldom ever go above that. I prefer the slightly higher frequency when doing thin aluminum, which is often what I'm welding. But 400hz is hard for me to tell a difference from 200 even on thin stuff. At higher amps, it simply wouldn't have any benefit.

Imho of course...

Oscar wrote:Yea I hear ya. But HTP is small-time (business-wise) compared to Miller. The machines do pack a powerful punch though!

If I were looking to get a 300-400A welder, I'd seriously consider them. Though it would be hard to get me to switch brands given that I'd almost have to trade in or buy new and sell the old. I would not be able to keep the old for sure.

JustTheDad wrote:If they had mentioned it or put information out on it 5 or 6 weeks ago, I might have waited and gotten just that instead of the 2 Miller machines I have. No real regrets for me because that thing is so heavy and I don't mind having the light MIG that I can take out to the detached garage we're building. Still, Jeff should be able to do better getting the word out. I even spoke with him a week or so ago and he didn't mention it, so now I have a Dynasty 210 DX... .

It looks really nice. Betting it will give the Dynasty 280 a run for the money!

Miller's have great re-sale value! That's what I hear...

Spartan wrote:Very nice. Seems like a good move to have an in-between unit like that. They had made a big jump going from the 221 to the 400. That'll be attractive for customers like me that are looking for machines in the 300 amp range.

Join the party

I run AC on about 150Hz max. I've played around with 250Hz (and even 500Hz on the new machine), and it did perform a bit better on very thin edge welds, but I don't really have a practical need for it. For AC, my machines almost always get dialed into 100Hz for most AL. A bit lower for the thick stuff (50-60Hz), and a bit higher for the thinner stuff (120-150Hz).

Same with the pulse frequencies. I just don't have a practical need for the extreme ranges that are coming out these days. I truly believe that a lot of it is just the marketing departments of these companies trying to compete with each other in order to advertise that their machine is more "bang for the buck". I think I saw one recently that goes up to 1kHZ on pulse. Seems crazy to me. May be beneficial for robotic welding, though.

Oscar wrote:

Spartan wrote:Very nice. Seems like a good move to have an in-between unit like that. They had made a big jump going from the 221 to the 400. That'll be attractive for customers like me that are looking for machines in the 300 amp range.

Join the party

I probably will. Also looking at their MIGs right now.

BugHunter wrote: At higher amps, it simply wouldn't have any benefit.

That is exactly what HTP told me is Stel's reasoning. The total heat input is drastically reduced at such a high AC frequency, that it doesn't make much sense to go over 200Hz when you're trying to weld thicker aluminum; on the contrary, you need more heat, so lower Hz is more beneficial to get back the heat energy you lose from so many "zero crossings" from the individual DCEP and DCEN components.

Spartan wrote:I run AC on about 150Hz max. I've played around with 250Hz (and even 500Hz on the new machine), and it did perform a bit better on very thin edge welds, but I don't really have a practical need for it. For AC, my machines almost always get dialed into 100Hz for most AL. A bit lower for the thick stuff (50-60Hz), and a bit higher for the thinner stuff (120-150Hz).

You should see what 20Hz on AC frequency does. Puddles instantly and puts out a TON of heat with very little amperage.

Spartan wrote:Same with the pulse frequencies. I just don't have a practical need for the extreme ranges that are coming out these days. I truly believe that a lot of it is just the marketing departments of these companies trying to compete with each other in order to advertise that their machine is more "bang for the buck". I think I saw one recently that goes up to 1kHZ on pulse. Seems crazy to me. May be beneficial for robotic welding, though.

For pulse, there is some evidence that ultra high frequencies have some benefit to create more penetration via intense arc-pressure on the puddle:

EWM - TIG - Direct-Current Welding with High-Frequency Pulses, an Interesting
Process Variant

...but that is more applicable for steel, as you can't pulse AC that fast without affecting the EN & EP profiles.

JustTheDad wrote:If they had mentioned it or put information out on it 5 or 6 weeks ago, I might have waited and gotten just that instead of the 2 Miller machines I have.

I don't know, I wouldn't trade your Dynasty, IMO, but call me old fashioned. You could have gotten a Dynasty 280 if you wanted...

At some point enough is enough, and that Dynasty you got is plenty to learn how to tig weld, and best in class.

Spartan wrote:Very nice. Seems like a good move to have an in-between unit like that. They had made a big jump going from the 221 to the 400. That'll be attractive for customers like me that are looking for machines in the 300 amp range.

I'll be curious to see if you actually purchase one. My guess is you'll stick with Everlast.

Spartan wrote:

Oscar wrote:

Spartan wrote:Very nice. Seems like a good move to have an in-between unit like that. They had made a big jump going from the 221 to the 400. That'll be attractive for customers like me that are looking for machines in the 300 amp range.

Join the party

I probably will. Also looking at their MIGs right now.

'atta boy! Getcha a Pro Pulse 300 fully loaded and marvel in awe at it's pulse-spraying awesomeness!

TraditionalToolworks wrote:

Spartan wrote:Very nice. Seems like a good move to have an in-between unit like that. They had made a big jump going from the 221 to the 400. That'll be attractive for customers like me that are looking for machines in the 300 amp range.

I'll be curious to see if you actually purchase one. My guess is you'll stick with Everlast.

The Everlasts have been good for me. All three I've had. The 350EXT is particularly nice. Even considering the mid-range (60-200 amps, and where I'm usually welding at), it is much improved over the previous ones I've had. I think they've been fine tuning both their hardware and their controller logic over the years. It's a solid performer so far. The AC is on point.

That 300A HTP sure is looking good, though. Love their coolers, so I do want to try out their welders. It may happen.

Oscar wrote:
'atta boy! Getcha a Pro Pulse 300 fully loaded and marvel in awe at it's pulse-spraying awesomeness!

It'll either be the HTP Pro Pulse 220, HTP Pro Pulse 300, Millermatic 211 or Millermatic 255.

The 211 is currently sitting on display at my LWS and with a discount, so that one may end up in my truck even though I think it is a bit under-powered for the long term.

I had the 211 and the arc is real nice, but it smoked the main board when I went over the duty cycle. I didn't check the over-temp light and the machine didn't turn off the output and poof the magic smoke dragon flew by. Two weeks later I had a Pro Pulse 300 at my door. Very sophisticated protection programming (on the 220MTS also) that both alerts when your arc length is too short and you're over the machine's maximum capabilities (amps), and shuts off [the output but keeps the fan on] if you exceed duty cycle. Some don't like it, but I think it's a blessing in disguise. HTP said on their FB page they had a pre-owned Pro Pulse 200 (no stick welding) for $1500 shipped, I don't know if they still have it though.

I've built an electronic Gizmo or two in my day, and I find it really hard to believe that these companies can't design in a simple thermal protection. Especially in an inverter machine. Discrete Electronic components which handle that type of safety are all but free. And they're not particularly new either.

Anyone considering the Miller 211 should watch this video.

-le-TIqoUbE

Video no worky.