Miller 211 cold start?

Deerhunter1911a1 · Tue Aug 26, 2014 11:05 pm

Howdy all! I searched but didn't find a ton...but didn't search for days so excuse me if this is a repeat thread.

Now the meat:

I was building a welding table and welding a 1/4" mild steel top to the 060 1x2" steel frame using .035 wire and 25/75 gas on my Miller 211 on 230V and I was getting cold starts! I don't remember my settings off the top of my head but I was run in good beads on scrap 1/4" steel and was ready to go. I pull the trigger, and got a pop or two before the arc really started burning and welding. I had a tight arc, clean wire, short stick out, and the settings were good; the weld really burned in there! In fact, after pulling the trigger I could hear the machine essentially "kick over" and put out the voltage I needed.

It was the first time I'd ever welded anything that thick and penetration wasn't a huge issue so I didn't have the machine REALLY cranked up, but it was definitely burning in.

Before I call Miller, has anyone experienced anything similar or have any quick fixes? Maybe I just needed a bit more voltage?

I am away from my machine but I can get the settings I was using next week or so.

Thanks in advance!

MinnesotaDave · Wed Aug 27, 2014 7:25 am

Since you are welding the top, did you do this in the overhead position? Sometimes you need to tweak your settings a bit when you go overhead.

Or, how was your ground? Mig needs an excellent ground or it'll pop on start-up pretty often because the wire keeps coming out regardless of the ground.

Be careful welding your top, short tacks or you'll warp it and curse yourself for years

Deerhunter1911a1 · Wed Aug 27, 2014 7:43 am

I wasn't overhead but I was welding hirizontal. I had the machine set where I was comfortable and I wasnt just melting metal, lol. I tacked the top in a few places on each side then backstep welded each side in opposite directions on each parallel to prevent warpage. It came out really well.

My ground was good. I scuffed the steel so it was clean and bare, was within 12" of where I was welding, and was using a strong hand tools grounding clamp that is pure copper where the cable attaches.

I think if I had cranked up the voltage I may have fixed the problem but also burnt a hole into the frame.

Thanks for the reply!!

Ps ill post pics when I get home but my droid is acting up right now, lol

johnnyg · Wed Aug 27, 2014 8:29 am

Wouldn't be to worried about the burnthrough on 1/4" steel with that machine... When you say 'cold start'
is it visible when you're don welding, or you are just annoyed with the popping to get the arc started? If it's irritating, initiate the arc 1/2" in from the start and do a backstep so the start of your weld has a good arc.

Deerhunter1911a1 · Thu Aug 28, 2014 12:25 am

I was worried about burn through on the 060 steel square tubing, not the edge of a 3'x4' 1/4" steel plate, lol. The cold start is not evident in the weld; id back track just like you said and it made a good, strong, even pretty weld.

It is annoying and I'm wondering if maybe I just needed a smidge more voltage, though I thought I tried that too. Hearing the machine kick over is, I guess, my real question. I suppose to expect 0 to 200A is a bit to ask (and im just using 200 as an arbitrary number lol) but I wasn't sure if it was common or cause for concern?

Braehill · Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:13 am

Could it be that your machine has a fan on demand feature and what you're hearing is the fan coming on? One other thing that comes to mind is perhaps your drive wheels slip slightly when you begin your welds. I'm in no way an expert on Mig welding but those are just a couple of random thoughts.

Len

brokeitagain · Thu Sep 04, 2014 8:07 pm

if it is the same as my 211 with mvp and autoset......never use the autoset. the ground clamp that was included with mine was substandard in my opinion so I swapped out for a brass one

Deerhunter1911a1 · Sat Sep 06, 2014 3:15 am

Auto set has never worked well for me. I run beads on scrap to set the machine how I want it then do it for real. And I am using a strong hand tools copper ground clamp. Ground is NOT an issue lol.

Sat Sep 06, 2014 7:43 pm

I find the "stuttering start" to be pretty common at the level you described. A constant-voltage source must adjust current to the joint resistance, and at certain settings, it takes a half-second or so to stabilize. The circuit that does this can only be tuned to be "ideal" at certain settings, and in other ranges it's a compromise.

There's no reason NOT to call Miller and discuss it, to rule out other issues, but to me (and I often use Miller 251, 252, and a Lincoln CV305 with remote feeder), this is just a "nature of the beast" problem for short-circuit MIG.

Steve S

Deerhunter1911a1 · Sun Sep 07, 2014 11:58 am

Otto Nobedder wrote:I find the "stuttering start" to be pretty common at the level you described. A constant-voltage source must adjust current to the joint resistance, and at certain settings, it takes a half-second or so to stabilize. The circuit that does this can only be tuned to be "ideal" at certain settings, and in other ranges it's a compromise.

There's no reason NOT to call Miller and discuss it, to rule out other issues, but to me (and I often use Miller 251, 252, and a Lincoln CV305 with remote feeder), this is just a "nature of the beast" problem for short-circuit MIG.

Steve S

Perfect answer! that is exactly what i was looking for. i will definitely call Miller and discuss, but that makes sense. it welded extremely well once it was going, it just took a second to get there, lol.