Small welding table...
Posted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 7:29 am
[no input needed]
Yes, EXACTLY! I have most of the pieces cut for the cart, but really needed something to build it on, and be able to use for tig as well. I'm pretty limited on space, so need it on casters.tungstendipper wrote:Looks good! So are you building this table so you can build your cart?
No, I'm not. It has some angle iron under the top to help support it, but in the past I've used it for just a stand.cj737 wrote:I would not expect too much from a 1/8" piece of steel for flatness, rigidity, or durability.
Indeed, I am aware of that. I don't think it will matter for a welding cart, and I do have some room in the garage if I move my 2nd car, or is the the 3rd or 4th car??? Either way I can make space...cj737 wrote:Any time you weld on top of that, the ambient heat I think will "oil can" it and effect your layout. Just saying...
We're on the same page, in fact, that's why I want to get the certiflat table. I don't think I can build it for much less than I would spend to buy material doing it, and it would take some time to drill the holes. No plasma here...cj737 wrote:For your true welding table, a piece of 1/2" or better, plate steel is all you need. 1/2" if the table will be small, 5/8" is better.
Alan it sounds as if you have this well thought out, know your current limitations (table)and are capable of making it work for you, that's what its all aboutaland wrote: What say ye? Does that make sense?
Alan
I’m not too picky with these as my drill is fluid fed, so they all seem to cut about the same. Champion, Hougen, I’ve even got a decent set of Evos but they’re only 1”. I’m far more particular about my cutting fluids (Walter Ice Cut)motox wrote:cj737
what brand 5/8" annual cutter do you use?
craig
Sure does if that’s the size you’re restricted to. If you opt the DIY route, and are within a reasonable distance, I’ll drop my Mag Drill off to you and you can poke holes until you go sterile. I’m in central VA and travel between MD and Adam weekly. Anywhere along that path?aland wrote:No, I'm not. It has some angle iron under the top to help support it, but in the past I've used it for just a stand.cj737 wrote:I would not expect too much from a 1/8" piece of steel for flatness, rigidity, or durability.
I don't plan to do any critical setups on it, other than small stuff like the welding cart...but ultimately this will be replaced in 2-3 months.
Indeed, I am aware of that. I don't think it will matter for a welding cart, and I do have some room in the garage if I move my 2nd car, or is the the 3rd or 4th car??? Either way I can make space...cj737 wrote:Any time you weld on top of that, the ambient heat I think will "oil can" it and effect your layout. Just saying...
We're on the same page, in fact, that's why I want to get the certiflat table. I don't think I can build it for much less than I would spend to buy material doing it, and it would take some time to drill the holes. No plasma here...cj737 wrote:For your true welding table, a piece of 1/2" or better, plate steel is all you need. 1/2" if the table will be small, 5/8" is better.
For $200, I can get their 2'x3' ProTable. I can buy enough tube for about $30-$35 and re-purpose some casters and weld up a stand for it which is really similar to a welding cart structure.
I calculated that a 2'x3' piece of 1/2" plate would weigh approx. 125 lbs. That's about $80 at scrap price ($0.65/lb) or double that for new material. If I was buying new material I would start getting close to the price of the certiflat. Now, to be fair...the certiflat is not 1/2" thick plate, but the fact that it has the tab-n-slot grid on the bottom should keep it flat, and it has the holes in the top already. And yeah, I looked at used prices of MagDrills and they seem to go for about $400-$600 used for a decent Hougen or Milwaukee or similar. I would need a 5/8" annual cutter also, could pick one up but they aren't cheap...I know I could rent one, but haven't priced that, probably $30-$40/day. You get the idea...this is just temp until I can get the table, but since I can't build the table cheaper than the certiflat, for the interim I figure I would cut this table down, build the welding cart and use this to learn how to tig, and I could use it for stick welding also, just that I'm setting it up lower for a more comfortable tig table.
That's been the basis of wanting the certiflat, but what do you think about this idea? I have some firebricks, I was thinking to use those like pucks on this little table so I could fixture the tube fairly flat without getting so much heat to the table itself. I've seen people doing that with metal rounds, but even though firebrick is brittle and can crumble, I think it would be ok for some quick and dirty fixturing like the welding cart. Also if I weld over the edge of the table, it would keep the heat away from the surface as well. It is my plan because it is what I have.
What say ye? Does that make sense?
Alan
Thanks for the vote of confidence! I probably spend more time than needed and over think making my workspace as usable as I can, but I like to be comfortable if possible. tig welding requires patience and it seems to make sense to make the environment comfortable. I am limited on space and unfortunately budget so trying to work with what I have.LtBadd wrote:Alan it sounds as if you have this well thought out, know your current limitations (table)and are capable of making it work for you, that's what its all about
tungstendipper wrote:Looking good Billy Ray! (what movie did that come from) Trading Places
Have you ever thought of finding someone who has a water jet to cut you a certiflat table top? I have a friend who has one and charges 90 bucks an hour. If you do the CAD drawing. I wish i knew this before ordering my Certiflat table. Besides water jetting the slots, you still need to mill both sides of the material to insure "flatness". A water jet can't do that. It can be done by Blanchard Grinding, but that costs extra money.
Certiflat tables aren't ground either. That's a luxury I dream about. I'm grateful just to have a 3" X 4" area that is level and some what flat. For years I had nothing, except for a 4' X 4' particle board table with a 1/2" bow in it. I don't understand the advantage for going with a ground table for welding. For machinist work it would be cat's meow. In a welding environment don't you have to worry about welding and grinding spatter? Then how do you clean it? I would be afraid of grinding on it, not mention welding on it.cj737 wrote:tungstendipper wrote:Looking good Billy Ray! (what movie did that come from) Trading Places
Have you ever thought of finding someone who has a water jet to cut you a certiflat table top? I have a friend who has one and charges 90 bucks an hour. If you do the CAD drawing. I wish i knew this before ordering my Certiflat table. Besides water jetting the slots, you still need to mill both sides of the material to insure "flatness". A water jet can't do that. It can be done by Blanchard Grinding, but that costs extra money.
Yeah, the more I think about it the better it is...I might have a an old Crapsman, I have 2 or 3 Nogas, but I think i have another older style with just pivot rods. I just need to adapt something with 3/8" pin.tungstendipper wrote:Go with the mag base.
Well, they're certainly not the only game in town, and the StrongHand BuildPro tables are pretty nice as a couple others I've seen. But at the end of the day the Certiflat gives the tab-n-slot, it's the frame that allows you to secure it and weld it flat. Even if I was to make the plates, still needs the frame.tungstendipper wrote:Have you ever thought of finding someone who has a water jet to cut you a certiflat table top?
My understanding is that none of them are flat, it's when you clamp it all together when you weld it is what make it and keeps it flat. You can do that with u-bolts.tungstendipper wrote:BTW...My 3' X 4' Certiflat table wasn't flat.
That's another thing with the fabBlocks, they have options for thicker material. Even still, I haven't heard of anyone complaining, unless it was assembled wrong. I've seen several videos of people welding them up, they seem very flat, even the ProTable and I think it's only 1/4". The frame is only 2" thick on those, where the fabBlock is 6" I think. But the 2x2 block will allow a lot of expansion and additions that work with the table.tungstendipper wrote:So now I have a top that is just short of being a 1/2"
I did contact them. They told me my top came off the end of the roll of steel, and their reverse rollers did not take out the bow. The u bolts you are referring to makes the top strait when clamped to the stiffeners provided. My top bowed their stiffeners! So I shimmed the low spots a clamped the high spots. This got it half way. So the then they told me to place the top with the stiffeners welded on, between to 4x4's and use a sledge hammer to beat it level.My understanding is that none of them are flat, it's when you clamp it all together when you weld it is what make it and keeps it flat. You can do that with u-bolts.
Are you saying that your table was not flat after you assembled it? If so, could be faulty parts. You should contact them.
I would love to see your shop and learn more from you.cj737 wrote:If you want to fixture up something, having a table thats flat to a tolerance is important as everything you do during setup is based upon the table. But that's dependent upon what you're doing. Weld splatter is controlled with sprays or surface treatments.
Plate steel is not flat. Not by a long shot. Having it blanchard ground to within a reasonable tolerance is a great idea if your needs dictate. I had mine done to 0.01 because that's as critical as I wanted it. I have just always made my own tables because I want a larger surface than they sell for a reasonable price. And I want a much thicker slab for rigidity due to surface size.
Bring a pack of matches with you. Everything I can teach you, you can write on the head of a wooden match and still have room to sign ittungstendipper wrote: I would love to see your shop and learn more from you.
td,tungstendipper wrote:The u bolts you are referring to makes the top strait when clamped to the stiffeners provided. My top bowed their stiffeners!
I don't know about that, you've been pretty helpful to me, and I've seen quite a bit more info than would fit on that match head, just in the time I've seen you posting here.cj737 wrote:Bring a pack of matches with you. Everything I can teach you, you can write on the head of a wooden match and still have room to sign it
They did say it was a defect. That's why they gave me the 1/4" top at cost.They didn't say that was a defect if the top bowed the stiffeners?
All that said, I still think they provide a pretty good value for what they offer.tungstendipper wrote:They did say it was a defect. That's why they gave me the 1/4" top at cost.
BTW... They are great people to deal with.
I didn't want to sound like Certiflat tables are bad. My table, now that I have used it, and flattened it, using all my different home-made clamps, is one of the top tools I've have ever bought. I now can clamp my work to my new table that I've never been able to do. Everyday, I'm amazed how precisely the table and clamps holds the work in every configuration. I would recommend a Certflat to anyone!aland wrote:All that said, I still think they provide a pretty good value for what they offer.tungstendipper wrote:They did say it was a defect. That's why they gave me the 1/4" top at cost.
BTW... They are great people to deal with.
I see you have the ProTable also, don't those come with 3/16" normally? I didn't know they could make a 1/4" top, I don't think they offer that option on their website.
I did mentioned the FabBlocks have 3 sizes, as I recall, but I considered that a plus with the blocks. I guess if they would upgrade the ProTables that would be a plus also. the real value in the blocks and mix/match what you like, lots of options.
Even still, does the Adjustable Fab Square seem like a good value at $39.99 ? I was considering getting it with the ProTable when I order it...I would spend more time and money reproducing the same wheel...
https://weldtables.com/products/8x8x3-a ... u-weld-kit
Alan
I think I misunderstood where you were coming from, but I want one and couldn't agree more about being able to clamp things straight and flat and be able to build $#!T in general. That is what it's all about at the end of the day...tungstendipper wrote:I didn't want to sound like Certiflat tables are bad. My table, now that I have used it, and flattened it, using all my different home-made clamps, is one of the top tools I've have ever bought. I now can clamp my work to my new table that I've never been able to do. Everyday, I'm amazed how precisely the table and clamps holds the work in every configuration. I would recommend a Certflat to anyone!
Oh, I didn't realize you have both. Did they make special tabs for the bottom structure to extend through both layers of the top?tungstendipper wrote:The 3/16 top is what it came with and I added a 1/4 top on top of the 3/16".
I would do it with an engine hoist. I have a 8,000 lb. rough terrain forklift, but it's not at my house...tungstendipper wrote:I wanted the FabBlock 3'x4' but I had no way of flipping it over to clamp and weld the bottom. It was just to heavy weld without an overhead crane. The fab block is what I would recommend to you because of the wide sides and the ability to clamp work to them.
I thought it looks convenient for small stuff. I wish I had one now that I could use to use for practice welding. My little table will do and I could always weld something at an angle so I could simulate the same thing. When i order my table I'm gonna get one.tungstendipper wrote:The adjustable square looks great, and a deal for 40 bucks. For tacking it's fine; I don't know if it could stand up to the forces of a welds pulling.
You need to read my past posts on this.Oh, I didn't realize you have both. Did they make special tabs for the bottom structure to extend through both layers of the top?