Welding Tips and Tricks

For 8 years we have had a 4ft x 4ft welding fab table that worked out but just wasn't big enough for the new builds we were asked to do for operations, the shop manager cleaned up the yard and 6 loads of scrap later we had the funds to build a new layout/fab table

These are some of the photos of the build we did this week and the final assembly, the top is out of 1in A572 grade 50, (should have went with 2in but $2400 was a little high) legs are 6in x 1/2, braces are 4in x 3/8, welded out with 045, GMAW

Mike

Nicely done.

That table is huge! There is more steel in that thing than it took to build my house, my shed and both my cars. I have seen rail bridges with thinner legs than that!

Trust it gives many years of good service.


Kym

Now to upgrade the concrete floor to support the table.
You sure its big enough

Mike,
Very well constructed table there! Now you can hide under that table if a tornado comes through town.
-Jonathan

Very nice, indeed! The top is thick enough to remain flat even after the welds at the posts.

This is the weakness of our work tables... The one who designed them spec'd 1/2" tops sitting on posts with an angle iron frame, stitch welded both sides of the angle at 6 on 18", so we don't have a flat table in the shop. This is "relatively minor" with the work we do, but for some tasks it's extremely annoying. I've even grabbed a full- or half-sheet of 3/8 plate and set it on the table when I need "very flat", but that takes some shimming across the table to keep the 3/8 from sagging with weight on it. Major PITA!

I envy you the new table. I may suggest our next scrap-out be used toward a similar purpose. We could use one more table (Who couldn't?) and I'd love it to be dead-flat and solid enough to hammer on.

Steve S

That table definitely counts as one where the person running into it is more likely to notice than the person welding on it.

Even if the person running into it is in a car at the time.



Kym

I remember years ago, probably about 30+ years ago, in a shop I had, I custom built a weld table. There were lots of hanging down things from it; spaces where I could put my stinger, hang a grinder, etc. One of my customers was visiting and he kept looking at one of my 'special' attachments. Finally he asked me what that was for; it was a thin-walled tube, about 4 1/2" ID, eight inches long, with a hook for hanging it anywhere on the table.

Rather than explain, I went over to the fridge, pulled out a bottle of Boone's Farm, opened it, took a sip, dropped the bottle in the holder and went back to work.

It just pays to be prepared for everything in your own shop!
Gary

Otto Nobedder wrote:Very nice, indeed! The top is thick enough to remain flat even after the welds at the posts.

This is the weakness of our work tables... The one who designed them spec'd 1/2" tops sitting on posts with an angle iron frame, stitch welded both sides of the angle at 6 on 18", so we don't have a flat table in the shop. This is "relatively minor" with the work we do, but for some tasks it's extremely annoying. I've even grabbed a full- or half-sheet of 3/8 plate and set it on the table when I need "very flat", but that takes some shimming across the table to keep the 3/8 from sagging with weight on it. Major PITA!

I envy you the new table. I may suggest our next scrap-out be used toward a similar purpose. We could use one more table (Who couldn't?) and I'd love it to be dead-flat and solid enough to hammer on.

Steve S

Hint
Pick the low spots ,drill and tap some fine thread through holes, screw bolt up from back side, throw the 3/8 plate on and level(make flat).clamp plate to table to avoid welding distortion.
Remove/back off when not in use.

One of the places I am doing a 'custom training' at purchased 1 1/4" 6' X 10' tables. They had the tops milled, or ground, or something down to very, very tight tolerances. They are as level as is possible to get. I was told each table costs about $2,000. But this is what they need! They make components for buses and weld a lot of stainless tube for handrails.
Gary

Boomer63 wrote:One of the places I am doing a 'custom training' at purchased 1 1/4" 6' X 10' tables. They had the tops milled, or ground, or something down to very, very tight tolerances. They are as level as is possible to get. I was told each table costs about $2,000. But this is what they need! They make components for buses and weld a lot of stainless tube for handrails.
Gary

Over here for a table of that quality and size that is a cheap table.
I recently enquired on a price for a cast table, machined top, 1 meter x1 meter, 16mm holes in top for jigs and fixtures, price over $4000 AUD delivered.

ex framie wrote:

Boomer63 wrote:One of the places I am doing a 'custom training' at purchased 1 1/4" 6' X 10' tables. They had the tops milled, or ground, or something down to very, very tight tolerances. They are as level as is possible to get. I was told each table costs about $2,000. But this is what they need! They make components for buses and weld a lot of stainless tube for handrails.
Gary

Over here for a table of that quality and size that is a cheap table.
I recently enquired on a price for a cast table, machined top, 1 meter x1 meter, 16mm holes in top for jigs and fixtures, price over $4000 AUD delivered.

Why is that? The unavailability of shops that can do the work? Scarcity of material, or both? It is amazing to me sometimes how much difficulty you guys 'Down Under' have as compared to what we do in the US!
Gary

A few reasons.
Where we are, basically nowhere near anywhere else.
We no longer have a viable manufacturing industry, the suits decided that it was better to give all our tech away to china andt have them make substandard product and sell it at the same price as aussie made stuff as it was better for their bottom line.
Exchange rates
Freight charges these tables are weighty little suckers.
Taxes
Importers work on doubling the manufactures price, distributos work on doubling the importers price.
Get the picture?

Anybody own a big enough boat we can load up with Argon, welding tables and welders?

Rick_H wrote:Anybody own a big enough boat we can load up with Argon, welding tables and welders?

I'd settle on just the argon, thanks!

Convinced that I bought a decent welding machine for reasonable money and can cope for now with my table. But still unable to see the funny side of paying 4X the U.S. price for gas.


Kym

Y'all just sent my twisted mind in a new direction.

The medical industry has figured out the "oxygen concentrator" for COPD patients. I'm going to have to look in to the technology, just to see if it would be possible and practical (and if so, at what scale) to do something similar for argon. For efficiency, a fume-extractor could be put in the circuit to recycle argon as it's used.

My gut reaction is that this is not going to be practical for the individual, due to the purity required (but that area gets greyer for mixed-gasses for MIG welding), but perhaps it could be doable on a co-op basis in a community.

Just pipe-dreaming at the moment, as I've never looked at how oxygen concentrators work.

Steve S

I think there is a place in Wisconsin were they use a super cooled chamber to separate all the separate gasses out of air at different temps for each gas. It's kinda cool. You Aussies need to pool your scrap money and set one up down there. Unless the air isn't the same.

So what do they use for the cooling?
Liquid nitrogen?
Refer comments on gas prices.......

We're struggling filling an E sized bottle, setting up an argon production plant is a lot above my income and skill set.
There is basically 1 gas producer here, Liquidair.
They operate under 3 names, Liquidair, BOC , Core gas.
There are a couple of smaller players like Speedie gas but thats it.
Dont forget we have about 320,000,000 people less than you do, therefore no real economies of scale, which is why you guys refill a bottle for roughly $55 Aud and we cop $171Aud.

Having a whinge is a great Australian past time, have to vent somehow or there would be blood in the streets.

Nice work!

Think they use standard cycntrifical chillers to get down to single deg temps then they change the pressure increase and decrease it to get some gasses to turn to liquid while others just separate.

Poland308 wrote:I think there is a place in Wisconsin were they use a super cooled chamber to separate all the separate gasses out of air at different temps for each gas. It's kinda cool. You Aussies need to pool your scrap money and set one up down there. Unless the air isn't the same.

Come on Poland, get serious here! Obviously the air is the same! It just falls off because they are up-side-down.

Right they do have different air there upside down. Probably not enough o2 to even breathe down there.

Poland308 wrote:Right they do have different air there upside down. Probably not enough o2 to even breathe down there.

The air here is great, but obviously because we're upside down it falls up. Happily, seeing as our nostrils point down, the air just falls into them. That's why we always say "Breathe easy mate, you're in Australia now!"

Not sure how you northerners cope, having to suck all of that downward-falling air into your nostrils. Hard work, surely? Not to mention the problems your aircraft must have taking off.



Kym

Well a body could always stand on his head but there is always the risk of falling through your ass.

MosquitoMoto wrote:

Poland308 wrote:Right they do have different air there upside down. Probably not enough o2 to even breathe down there.

The air here is great, but obviously because we're upside down it falls up. Happily, seeing as our nostrils point down, the air just falls into them. That's why we always say "Breathe easy mate, you're in Australia now!"

Not sure how you northerners cope, having to suck all of that downward-falling air into your nostrils. Hard work, surely? Not to mention the problems your aircraft must have taking off.

Kym

We keep our noses turned up. Often mistaken as a sense of superiority. In realty, just efficiency in breathing.

Also, how a wing works depends on the orientation of the airfoil. I assume all flights between the U.S. and Australia use wings with symmetrical airfoils, and deflect them accordingly.



Steve S