[Coldman]

That's just weird. Never see that before. Maybe you pushed the wire too hard and shifted it?

[RamboBaby]

I don't think so. It rotated in the direction of travel.....the same direction that I was pushing the wire from. I suspect it may be due in part from too much heat input which was due to too little amperage. The first one was so bad that I couldn't do anything with it. That one was tacked at 75 amps. I'm gonna cut that one apart and try tacking it again with 115 amps. Getting the amperage correct on the first try is probably a good idea.
I'm generally very gentle with the feed wire because I ised to push it into the tungsten constantly.

[RamboBaby]

6G test stand almost complete. Gonna make another piece for 5G as well.
Made a bevel gauge too. I lucked out and my coupons just worked out to be the correct angle (37 degrees) even though I was shooting for 45 degrees. You can see that they line up with the gauge almost as good as the only one that my buddy turned on his lathe for me. The stars must have been aligned just right.

Test stand.

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Hand ground coupon.

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Lathe turned coupon.

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[Rick_H]

Coldman and Poland are right on, lots of good info. I agree most welds will be 2G and 5G, I have only welded 6g in a few instances other then a test, but I weld in uncomfortable awkward ass positions nearly all the time..lol They can't teach you that. Once your feeling comfortable with those position, put the pipe 2" from a wall and weld in a mirror

I use the wire just as Coldman explains, bend to a V, install and gap, tack and remove. Cant say I have ever had one pivot like you explained..

Personally 5g is harder, 6 o'clock can get ya....

[RamboBaby]

I have only welded 6g in a few instances other then a test

Dustin told me the same thing. Said he's welded 6G exactly twice, other than testing, in the last 13 years. He told me that it is very common for him to have to weld 5G @ 3" off the floor and 6" away from the wall.

Cant say I have ever had one pivot like you explained

It didn't just happen once. The first one was so bad that I had to cut it apart today. I was not able to twist it back like I did the second one.

[Coldman]

I recon your tacks must be too big ond overheating the surrounding pipe. Don't make them too much more than 1/2" long and keep fill to a minimum. They're meant to be consumed by the root pass.

[Poland308]

When I took my tests if you had a tack longer than 1/2in on a 6010 root you would get looked out before you went any farther. If it was tig root then it couldn't exceed 3/8.

[RamboBaby]

That sounds good to me. I don't wanna make em more than 3/8" because they make the coupons a nightmare to move.
I opened my gap up to roughly 5/32" and am about to lay my first root with dip and keyhole.

[Poland308]

When I tig a root I leave the bevel at a knife edge and run no gap. I run about 120 amps and use a 3/32 wire with a standard #4 cup. I lay the wire at the bottom of the bevel and I set my tungsten so that as I burry the cup as far as I can it almost touches the top of the wire. I also grind my tacks out as I come to them so that I'm not welding over them on test day.

[RamboBaby]

Well, it turned out like Fido. Looks like a newbie did it with a mig. It was way too much gap and I had to dial it back to 90 amps. Ive got better fitup on this next set. The image shows a 3/32" rod sitting in a tight 1/8" gap. It feels like I have about 1/32" of high-low on two opposing sides and flush on the other. Those tacks went in much easier as I got down on one knee. The other set of coupons was a damn sight impossible to fill the gap without putting a ton of metal into the groove. That's some of the worst tig welding that I've ever done.
That first one looks ridiculous so here goes round two.

[Oscar]

Well I can imagine that it takes more than a couple tries to get good at pipe welding.

[Coldman]

Try gapping and welding with 3/32" wire. 110amps knife edge and try Jody's forward and backwards method. Don't know anyone using dip keyhole method anymore it's too slow. Most lay the wire in the gap and weave over it which is a good forgiving method where there is an imperfect prep (which is most of the time).

[Rick_H]

Try gapping and welding with 3/32" wire. 110amps knife edge and try Jody's forward and backwards method. Don't know anyone using dip keyhole method anymore it's too slow. Most lay the wire in the gap and weave over it which is a good forgiving method where there is an imperfect prep (which is most of the time).

Large gaps can be a challenge even for seasoned pipe welders...luckily I know my fitter well..lol ME

Forward back works very well, that video is good.... then stack beads all the way out will till the cover, running the beads is what you need practice on, get use to what you are seeing. As far as feather the tacks, my ASME test would not let me, so tacks are critical, don't stop on top or start on one, weld right through the bitch and keep rockin. Brush really well between passes, let it cool till you can put your hand on the pipe is ideal, buy not needed on carbon. Snip the filler rod before you start back up

Well breaks over, I have some 1-1/2" 316L calling my name

[RamboBaby]

Back and forth just blows holes in the knife edges while sticking the rod ahead of the hole. If I turn the heat down enough to not blow a hole then it really doesn't want to fill the gap. There doesn't seem to be a happy medium. Dip and keyhole definitely isn't working for me either. I can get it to lay somewhat flat but that causes it not to penetrate fully. If I get full penetration then i also get massive buildup in the groove. The only thing that I've tried that even halfway works is to lay the wire in the gap and move steadily forward without moving back. But even that went to hell in the middle of the run and somehow pushed a lot of weld through the joint even hough I had no pressure on the wire.
#4 cup was too small and just went to hell by filling the cup with molten metal and then the cup melted. #6 was too big. #5 was just about right as long as I didn't have any stickout on the tungsten. If I have stickout then the outside of the bead looks good but it doesn't penetrate fully. No stickout makes it penetrate fully but also looks like a caterpillar sitting in the groove.
SS would probably work well for dip and keyhole because it wets out so much better but I'm not trying to go there. I don't have the gas or the money to go purging pipe.
How in the heck does anyone ever get good at this? I'm already very sick of grinding bevels on pipe. This is the most aggravating thing that I have ever tried to learn.
I really don't like not being able to control the amperage. Might as well be stick welding at this point.

[Coldman]

I still think you are putting too more filler into the root pass. Its meant to fuse the two edges together with penetration. That's all. At 110amps you need to be motoring. Hang around and you will blow through. If you want to slow it down go to 100amps. You should gave enough gas flow for at least 1/4" stick out. I use even more stick out so you can get the tip into the root.

[RamboBaby]

This is the one pass where i layed the wire on the joint and moved forward, not back and forth. It's 1/8 filler on a tight 1/8 gap. The other side was total schmoz so I walked the cup over it and it looks ok from the outside except for whatever trash caused porosity in the middle.
100 amps will blow through with the back and forth, so will 95. 90 is too cold. What the heck.....I just don't know what to do.
I prepped two sets of coupons for in the morning. Tried grinding out the root on one set and quickly realized that I just dont have the necessary equipment to make it work without going through waaay too much effort. At least I still have 14 more sets of coupons that I can use on both ends before I run out of pipe.

[Poland308]

Try one with no gap. And go to a smaller filler. At 1/8 filler you need to be at or above 120 amps to get compleatly tied in.

[Rick_H]

Don't sweat it, takes practice and you need to settle in on a technique and see what works best for you. You have been welding that long, pipe is a different ball game.

Practice, practice, practice. You need to get use to going around the pipe, torch angle etc..running beads on the outside of the pipe os a good drill.

[RamboBaby]

I just tried tacking one up at 120 amps and that is way too hot for these little 4" coupons. I peeled back the knife edges of the coupon within 1/4". There's no way that I can weld this thing that hot and that is with me oscillating the torch twice as fast as in any video that I have watched on this subject. This pipe is only about 3/8" thick and it doesn't provide enough quench for that kind of heat. So I turned the heat down to 100 and tried walking the cup on the opposite tack. That almost worked but it was really slow going.....just a bit too cold. Went to 105 and walked the cup on the third tack. Bingo!!!, I found the Baby Bear zone because that was just right. All of this tacking is in position #2 so positions #5 & #6 may require some slight modification but I think that I may have just found the heat zone and technique that are gonna work for me......I hope. I'm getting really tired of grinding because it's aggravating my carpal tunnel.
I have tried enough of these things by now to know that my gap is really gonna shrink by the time I get to the last quarter section of welding. And I know that I'm gonna need to make a wedge to stop that from happening.
Any of you guys have any other techniques or advice to help me prevent shrinkage?
Also, when you just keep welding through a tack do you add any filler on top of the tack or just run it dry til you get to the other side?
Edit:
I just went back out and checked my gap after letting the tacks cool an 1/8" has shrunk to a perfect 3/32". Since 105 amps worked well for tacking this thing up with a 1/8" spacer, should I bump the amperage up to 110 for 3/32" gap or should I go to 115 amps? I'm fuessing that walking the cup is working so well because it's allowing me to pull the heat away from those delicate little knife edges?
I really don't wanna screw this one up!

[Coldman]

The smaller the gap the more amps required. But if you're ending up with a 3/32" gap that's where you want to be right?
It's gonna be a couple hundred practice hours to achieve competency so you have to solve your wrist issue somehow.

[RamboBaby]

Ok, now I'm starting to make a little progress.....just a little.
I wasn't moving back enough to get the heat away from the leading edge and that's why I was blowing through. This is the left side of the pipe, torch in right hand. The bottom side turned out like crap so I went to the high side before completing it.
Started out with a free hand weave, stopped and went to a back and forth motion, then back to the weave to tie into the top side tack. It's just like they say in the videos; it doesn't push through as well with a weave as it does with back and forth. Weave leaves it flush or concave but back and forth pushes through about 1/16". I still can't handle much stickout, only between 3/32" & 1/8". Previously I had only been backing up about 1/8" but this time I went back about 3/8". I had turned it up to 110 amps and I can see why you guys keep saying that I need about 120 to properly tie in. You can see the back and forth motion between 10 & 11 o'clock inside the pipe. You can also see the knife edges of the pipe because 110 was too cold. It's amazing how it can push through that much and still not tie in fully. No wonder everyone says this is the hardest test. It's like 100 kicks in the balls on a daily basis while trying to learn this.

I do not want to be a pipe weldor. I still want to do aerospace. I'm just doing this in the hope of bein able to show prospective employers that, at least on one occasion, I passed and was certified on one of the hardest welding tests out there.
If I make it through this, will that cert be good enough to get my foot in the door in the field of my choosing?

[plain ol Bill]

The aircraft tubing test makes a 6G tube test look like a cakewalk.

[RamboBaby]

I'm gonna have to look that one up.....never heard of it til just now.

[RamboBaby]

Can't find anything on google or youtube concerning aircraft tubing test.
What is it? I'm ok at welding tubing. Not great, just passable.

[Oscar]

I do not want to be a pipe weldor. I still want to do aerospace. I'm just doing this in the hope of bein able to show prospective employers that, at least on one occasion, I passed and was certified on one of the hardest welding tests out there.
If I make it through this, will that cert be good enough to get my foot in the door in the field of my choosing?

I was about to say, this now looks and smells like a pipe welding thread! I don't wanna be a debbie downer, and this is just my opinion, but to pass one test, albeit a tought one, won't have many aerospace welding employers beating a path to your door to weld their aerospace equipment unless you have a proven track record and a good long list of previous employers that were satisfied with your work. Even then, I would think they would be looking specifically for certifications in aerospace-type welding & materials(?). If I were you I would look into going the route of Travis aka: FieldRes on Youtube, with proper schooling in various welding disciplines. Don't get me wrong, if you can get your foot in the door with less than that, hey more power to you! Also I would be calling up prospective aerospace welding employers to ask about general requirements. Make a spreadsheet to keep track of their requirements as many will likely have similar ones. Then weigh and evaluate their requirements as a function of how much you need to invest in said requirements so you can decide which avenue to pursue.