[ctmaybury]

Hi guys,

I'm practicing for a 6g test. Want to become a pipe welder, but realise I need lots of practice before embarrassing myself. The 7018 I've used a bunch in the past is looking pretty good, but the 1/8 6010 5p+ is difficult to learn. My machine is an old Miller dialarc. The 3 coarse ranges for dc are low= 10 to 55 amps, medium=40 to 190 amps high=125 to 310 amps. The fine amp control goes between 0 and 100. I seem to get the best results for the 6010 on medium 82. What would the amperage be at that setting? I don't know if my logic is right. There are 150 amps between the rating on medium (190-40=150) 82% of 150=123 then add 40 to that and I get 163 amps. I can get a similar weld by going to the high setting and about 28 on the fine setting. There is no dig feature on the old miller, but I understand that by going to high gear with the fine set low is similar to turning up the dig and increasing penetration on a modern welder. Either way, I can really jamb the rod into the puddle without sticking. My best results seem to come from the shortest arc.

I love this forum. I have read the first 11 pages of this smaw section and have 2 seasons of Jodies dvds. Never been to a welding school, but self taught myself 30 years ago 7018 with some reading and practice. I used it intermittently at work over the years. The whip and pause 6010 is much harder than the 7018 imo.

Thanks in advance for any advice from the pros.

Charles

[MinnesotaDave]

Your theories are correct in my opinion.

What rod are you running at 163 amp btw?

[ctmaybury]

That's the 1/8 6010 5p+. I'm running the 7018 a bit hotter at medium coarse and 90 fine. That would work out to 175 amps. Seems a bit hot for 1/8 rod, but actual current might be lower. I haven't tried any open root welds yet, just stacking beads in flat position and lap joints in flat position. I'm going to get more comfortable with 1g 2g 3g and 4g lap before moving on to open root. I had a bunch of 6 inch schedule 40 cut into 2 inch lengths for practice after I get better at plate. I'm trying to get a few hours in every night, but life gets busy. I'm going to make a setup for grinding the bevels on the pipe.

Still not happy with the 6010. I hope the 8010 is easier to use than the 6010. Still have to get a can of 8010. I got 50# of 5p+ and plenty of 7018.

[olek]

Hello

About 7018, I did read recntly that whip and pause is not considered good practice, because the risk of loosing gas shield hence obtaining porosities

I think this was from Lincoln instructions, may be ESAB

WHat do you think ?

[MinnesotaDave]

That's the 1/8 6010 5p+. I'm running the 7018 a bit hotter at medium coarse and 90 fine. That would work out to 175 amps. Seems a bit hot for 1/8 rod, but actual current might be lower. I haven't tried any open root welds yet, just stacking beads in flat position and lap joints in flat position. I'm going to get more comfortable with 1g 2g 3g and 4g lap before moving on to open root. I had a bunch of 6 inch schedule 40 cut into 2 inch lengths for practice after I get better at plate. I'm trying to get a few hours in every night, but life gets busy. I'm going to make a setup for grinding the bevels on the pipe.

Still not happy with the 6010. I hope the 8010 is easier to use than the 6010. Still have to get a can of 8010. I got 50# of 5p+ and plenty of 7018.

Something seems wrong here, your machine could be way off?

I run 1/8" 6010 around 90-100 amps and 1/8" 7018 125-135 amps mostly.

Do you have another machine to run against for comparison?

[MinnesotaDave]

Hello

About 7018, I did read recntly that whip and pause is not considered good practice, because the risk of loosing gas shield hence obtaining porosities

I think this was from Lincoln instructions, may be ESAB

WHat do you think ?

That is correct, whip and pause is for 6010 and 6011

[olek]

That's the 1/8 6010 5p+. I'm running the 7018 a bit hotter at medium coarse and 90 fine. That would work out to 175 amps. Seems a bit hot for 1/8 rod, but actual current might be lower. I haven't tried any open root welds yet, just stacking beads in flat position and lap joints in flat position. I'm going to get more comfortable with 1g 2g 3g and 4g lap before moving on to open root. I had a bunch of 6 inch schedule 40 cut into 2 inch lengths for practice after I get better at plate. I'm trying to get a few hours in every night, but life gets busy. I'm going to make a setup for grinding the bevels on the pipe.

Still not happy with the 6010. I hope the 8010 is easier to use than the 6010. Still have to get a can of 8010. I got 50# of 5p+ and plenty of 7018.

Something seems wrong here, your machine could be way off?

I run 1/8" 6010 around 90-100 amps and 1/8" 7018 125-135 amps mostly.

Do you have another machine to run against for comparison?

It may be possible that the amp regulation is really off, I heard that there is no much precision on those type of AC "shunt" welders.

Amperemetric pliers may give some better information I suppose (assuming it is an AC tool not DC)
There are cheap models that may do the job "approximatively " well (about 25 USD) . AC and DC amperemeter are more expnsive, while DC models can be find for 20 USD (Trotec for instance if onewant to avoid 100% Chinese)

[olek]

Hello

About 7018, I did read recntly that whip and pause is not considered good practice, because the risk of loosing gas shield hence obtaining porosities

I think this was from Lincoln instructions, may be ESAB

WHat do you think ?

That is correct, whip and pause is for 6010 and 6011

Thanks, I am learning how to use 7018 actually, different from the 6013 I have been mostly burning (plus some 99 Ni on iron, but that is another story

I seem to understand that : 1 you create the "puddle" , then 2 as soon it is large enough you move a little the electrode so it does not stick,3 then you come back (immediately) and begin to pull/attract the puddle from its edge, looking for the size you obtain to regulate the speed, I did find that only that way I could obtain a very short arc about 1,5 mm , the arc is almost not visible. Not too much slant (more 80 than 70) so the bead does not grow up , and the gas shield is still efficient.

If I did allow a longer arc, even well tense, I had a tendency to stick very often, may be because it gives too much heat to the electrode so the metal flow too fast . What do you think ?

My goal is to be capable of making thin beads, with minimum height (so to weld with 3 4 beads in angle for instance)**Thank you in advance for your thoughts.
I use 30 arc force and 20 or 30 hot start (more does not seem to agree with the graphite start)

Sorrry for the OT I should open a new thread may be

[ctmaybury]

I'm not using whip and pause with the 7018. I have the best looking welds with a 15 degree drag angle and very little manipulation. I do much better with stringers than weave. 6010 and whip and pause is what I'm trying to learn now. I thought I would pick it up quicker, but still working it. I made a spread sheet with a bunch of columns to keep track of all the changes settings and results.

I would like to get an ammeter to find out if my machine needs calibration or something. I'm going by the puddle and results not what it should be set at. With each rod, I change it 2% at a time and record results. I'm changing my whip and pause pattern to try to get the best results too. I still lack consistent motion.

[olek]

HI,

when I tried to copy the whip and pause from videos, I counted a 3 steps measure, as in music, that gave me a very even progression when I did try to reproduce the motion, counting 1,2,3

But I am musician, may be it helps

Good point to take notes, I made a welding note book , but alas, I tend to forget to note my regulations, and later it may be a little late. Still I have noted some regulations, metal thickness, rod brand and model, etc

This is certainly a good way to progress

I was said the tone of your buzz box tells you if you are doing well, it certainly works , welding teatcher say they recognize between students without looking at their work, just listening to the buzz

In thos sort of technical gesture that we learn by looking at someone doing , then try to reproduce, using a different sense than the most evident is always a good option (as concentrating on feel as well as the view, or the ears for instance) it gives another apprehension (as using left hand) and that may help.

Best regards

[ctmaybury]

Musical timimg would help. I should get a metronome like a beginning musician. I have to right everything down or I can't remember what worked and what didn't. I too keep a weld log lately so I can repeat settimgs that worked.

I'm still working on my engine driven legend. It sat for years unused and I didn't put it to bed properly. I should have blown the gas out of the carb. I now have to restore the carb. I want to replace the fine amperage control on it too before putting it back in service. I gave it all new tuneup parts last year. It's a good old welder worth the restoration effort. I ran 1/8 inch 7018 on it all day 30 years ago. I split the ground and had 2 guys setting up clamping chipping painting and stacking and I just went back and forth doimg the same flat weld all day. It truely was a 100% duty cycle.

[olek]

BTW , stringers vs weave ?

Are beads the result from electrode manipulation and stringers the "straight" beads ?

Sorry this is not my language , so I learn

My neighbor come for a help sometime, he did weld tubing for water in asia 30 years ago (he is vietnamese)

First time he tried on the old "buzz box 180A" that I had borrowed, he made a perfect bead

I was tempted to buy a second hand industrial model, but as a beginner this sounded a little risky , and also there are fiew models that work on mono 220V, most use 3 phase 380V

But some of those old TIG plus MMA, plus water coolant, can be find for about 300 USD , and those are very robust outdoor machines, that can be repaired more easily than modern inverters.

May be I will try to get one later , the AC mode is certainly better than on cheaper models from 30 years ago

AC DC Amp https://m.fr.aliexpress.com/item/2050159926.html 30 days delay , often free shipment , not in that case but I ordered 4 plastic sealed boxes for electrodes, about 8 USD each , no shipment cost (those boxes are not sold in France)
You may find an AC amp on Amazon or similar, for a small price
You may have checked that all screws are tight, clean etc ( an ultra sonic bath may help with your gas equipment ?)

Best regards