[KG1257]

I've been told 7018 is not a good rod to whip with, I don't mind not whipping when welding vertical up with them, but I like the results when I do. Does anyone know why you aren't supposed to whip with 7018s or is it nonsense?

[Ultralow787]

KG1257,
Do you mean "whip"? or "weave"? You can definitely weave 7018's going vertical up. Whip and Pause is more likely associated with 6010 or 6011 fast freeze type electrodes and is an entirely different movement.
When you weave, the tip of the electrode is moved back and forth usually in a tight "Z" pattern. The width can be as much as 3 times the electrode diameter including the flux coating. "Whip and pause" is moving the electrode forward and back where the electrode is moved about 1 electrode diameter forward of the puddle, and half way back into the puddle.
The amount of movement can vary a little, but this should give you an idea of the amount of movement.
In a lot of cases, the width of a weave bead is limited. If the thickness of the base metals and width of groove is too wide, then a split weave is used.
Hope this helps! If I missed the point completely, we'll try again! lol

[Otto Nobedder]

"Whip and pause" with 7018 creates little pockets of potential slag inclusion every electrode-width (or whatever your whip-length is).

The flux on a 7018 is dramatically different from 6010. It's a silicate base, and makes (dirty) glass, with a melting point close to that of steel. Whip-and-pause allows glass to form as fast as your puddle hardens, and those neat little beads may each have slag inclusions in them.

Steve S

[Ultralow787]

Okay, in re-reading your post, I think I did indeed miss your point!
If you whip a 7018 rod, there is a risk that you will weld back over the heavier slag and trap some of this slag into the weld bead. It is also the reason that you don't usually want to run vertical down with 7018. In most cases, the slag will tend to run ahead of you and the same condition will result. I'm not saying you positively can't run them vertical down, but you have to really be moving to stay ahead of the heavy slag.

Lincoln Electric prefers to say that 7018 is an "out of position" rod, rather than say "all position" for this reason. Generally the "1" in 7018 would indicate "all positions". In the case of 7018 (especially Excaliber), they say that they are best for Flat, Horizontal, Vertical Up, and Overhead.

Along the lines of this topic, has anyone used 7016 rods much?

[Ultralow787]

lol.....or as Steve says!

[Otto Nobedder]

That said,

A second look at the picture suggests your "whip" is very short. If it is less than an elctrode width, then you are simply running a stringer, with a slightly "jerky" motion.

My personal preference is to turn it up hot, jamb the rod in there, push up, and let the rod do the work. When it's just right, I can take my hood off, and turn and talk to you without breaking the arc.

Steve S

[weldin mike 27]

Hey,

A mate who welds stuctual and general site fab said he swears by 7016s . Easy as anything to weld vert up. Im yet to try apart from trades school.

Mick

[KG1257]

Thanks for the input everyone, I knew there had to be a good reason all the veterans I work with don't whip and pause vertical up, haha. So even though it can make a pretty weld the chance for slag inclusions isn't worth it =/, oh well. Back to lowering my heat and holding beads, thought I was on to something good .

[KG1257]

just adding a little more here, 1/8" 7018s, i believe the clip was 3/8" thick, and I was running at 135 amps soft.

[weldin mike 27]

Hey,
BTW welcome to the forum,

Drop by the member intro section and tell us a little about ya self.

Mick

[chadwarden]

Along the lines of this topic, has anyone used 7016 rods much?

Hey,

A mate who welds stuctual and general site fab said he swears by 7016s . Easy as anything to weld vert up. Im yet to try apart from trades school.

Mick

I can attest to this. I've welded (although just once) vertical with 6013s and 7016s side by side and I gotta say the 7016s were actually easier to weld with. The visual results were a lot nicer as well. 7016s just seem too good to be true.

[weldin mike 27]

Hey,

That dude also said 7016s are great for vertical downs on sheet metal, 1.6mm sheet.

Mick