Tig Trouble

Jason_alex · Sat Oct 18, 2014 7:26 pm

Hey guys I am starting to get into trying to tig weld again..... the biggest thing that has me discouraged is every time i add filler it turns the puddle gray I can just have the arc going on the stainless and be shinny but when I add the filler rod it turn it to a gray color.

I started out 10 ga at 115 A worked my way all the way down to 50 amps I am using 1/16 tungsten 2% Thoriated with a # 8 cup to try to keep the filler in the 100% argon after being dipped, after I trimmed the end and tried lay wire. Nothing it gets hard when the welds look bad in color to get focused on the shape.... any advice?

Jason_alex · Sat Oct 18, 2014 7:30 pm

2nd picture

Middle one was only a arch the other 2 where with filler added.
304SS Plate with 308 Filler

Braehill · Sat Oct 18, 2014 8:05 pm

Jason,
There's a point while welding stainless that the base metal reaches a temp (885*F if memory serves me) that promotes oxidation. You're probably going through that temp range right after you add filler metal, hence the color change, the gray is oxidation. If it cleans up with a brush, then it's fine. You can avoid this by keeping the puddle in the gas longer (i.e. bigger cup/more gas) so the puddle is enveloped in it while it goes through that temp range.

Len

Jason_alex · Sat Oct 18, 2014 8:25 pm

Okay I have seen this a little with mild steel.

Jason_alex · Sat Oct 18, 2014 8:29 pm

do I need to turn the temp down or what im only at 47 amps

Jacked800 · Sat Oct 18, 2014 11:22 pm

I'm new here and a little rusty with stainless, but I'm sure I haven't ever used a #8 cup doing stainless. I like a #5 or #6. Keeps the gas tight. Looks to me like you've got a gas issue. A lot depends to the machine you are using and your settings. Trying to guess at the exact issue without knowing the settings leave a wider area or guessing without any way of really knowing.
THANKS Jack

dsmabe · Sun Oct 19, 2014 2:59 am

One thing you might try is actually turning your amps up! Basically get in, and get out as fast as possible. Jody did a video about it before showing that trying to weld too cold puts more heat into the material than welding hot with a quick travel speed.

simondk · Sun Oct 19, 2014 4:01 pm

Hej
You welding to slow when you add filler, That means higher temp and more haet in put = more color

Or you sucking O2 in some plase.

Buy the Way you are use a gas lens ?

Superiorwelding · Mon Oct 20, 2014 10:38 pm

Jason,
My opinion, in the first picture you can see a hint of "color" but the welds look a little lumpy. I believe you are to low of amperage and are sitting there to long allowing the heat to build up. Evidence of that is actually the weld profile, not enough amps to completely lay the bead flat but to much dwell time causing heat input. The second thing I see actually points to to much heat but on the opposite end of the spectrum. The bottom bead is to hot. See how the bead is black and extremely flat? Again, either to much amperage or the plate was already to hot and running the given amperage to much heat input was put in causing it to "sugar".
To sum it up, it will take seat time to get thinner gauge SS down. It is not the easiest in my opinion. Keep up the good work and get us some updated pictures!
-Jonathan

christhewelder75 · Tue Oct 21, 2014 9:17 pm

I'm certainly no expert on tig or stainless (am wrapping up 8 weeks of schooling for my second year this week 3weeksGTAW 5 of SMAW) but i am thinking u are getting too much heat into the material.

one of our test welds is a 3F on i think 14ga stainless. i run my machine (dynasty 200) at 43amp with pulse 4.6pps 80% and 40%
and once getting the puddle goin i try to move thru as quick as possible while still getting fusion on the toes.

stainless seems picky, like if i bump the pulse per second up to 5 and i get bad color and issues.

Tue Oct 21, 2014 9:29 pm

Christhewelder75,

You're not going to like this, but...

If, in an eight-week course, you're learning all about pulse, you're not learning to weld. You're learning to use advanced features to make beads.

The pulse features should not be introduced until you've been welding at least a year with some measurable success.

You'll be sorely disappointed when you take that weld test for the job you want, and they hand you an old Synchrowave or PrecisionTig transformer machine, and you have to do it (what, to you will appear to be) the hard way.

Steve S

rick9345 · Wed Oct 22, 2014 10:46 am

I am somewhat old fashioned
With or without school one should still find a mentor to become a welder
The right mentor will accelerate the learning curve no matter what the chosen profession.
The ability to listen/observe/evaluate valued added

Two kinds of good welders, Skill gifted,Skill aquired A good welder is not just a machine operator
Like OTTO says be prepared to test

kiwi2wheels · Wed Oct 22, 2014 1:03 pm

Being a grumpy old barsteward , it always surprised me that people would try to TIG ( or buy a welder ! ) without ever reading about the principles and techniques. To say nothing of the " nuts and bolts " of the hardware , consumables, etc.

If you have an idea what you are trying to do, it makes it somewhat easier to identify and correct problems when you are starting out. From then on , you never stop learning............................Agree 100% with rick9345.

I quite like this publication ; http://www.amazon.co.uk/Gas-Tungsten-Ar ... b_title_bk

Maybe Jody could add it to his store offerings.

christhewelder75 · Wed Oct 22, 2014 11:25 pm

Otto Nobedder wrote:Christhewelder75,

You're not going to like this, but...

If, in an eight-week course, you're learning all about pulse, you're not learning to weld. You're learning to use advanced features to make beads.

The pulse features should not be introduced until you've been welding at least a year with some measurable success.

You'll be sorely disappointed when you take that weld test for the job you want, and they hand you an old Synchrowave or PrecisionTig transformer machine, and you have to do it (what, to you will appear to be) the hard way.

Steve S

for the record this is a course for apprentices with 3000+ hours to move from second to third year apprentices

I wouldnt say the course was "all about pulse" it was presented as a way to help control heat input into our stainless steel welds on thin materials.

it was presented as a tool to help with aluminum welds to help with using the dip technique. (didnt much like it for alum.)

We were taught first on how to work without pulse and get used to that before being introduced to the pulse options and advantages.

I definately need a ton more helmet time with tig to say i'm "proficient" in all aspects but it never hurts knowing how to use tech to your advantage when its available. At the same time i totally get what you're saying one needs a base of knowledge on how to do things with the bare minimum as well as with all the bells and whistles.

either way not much i can do about second year technical training curriculum

i have had lots of fun playing around with their gear:)

3F stainless

2G GTAW root on 3/8" mild steel plate

rick9345 · Thu Oct 23, 2014 8:42 am

A good welder is their own worst critique

Thu Oct 23, 2014 8:40 pm

My apologies, Chris,

I saw "8-week course", with no reference to it being a "stage" in a longer program. An 8-week course on its's own is what I was dogging on. Since this is an 8-week "stage" in a much longer course, please disregard my previous comments.

Steve S

christhewelder75 · Thu Oct 23, 2014 9:07 pm

no worries at all steve
the system for training here in canada is a bit different from that in the US from what i understand

Postby rick9345 » Thu Oct 23, 2014 6:42 am
A good welder is their own worst critique

so so true.